Feral Is Bringing Total War: WARHAMMER 2 To Linux

[PackRat]

There's more to Linux/Windows and a game than just the graphics API...

Even non-technical things, such as customer support, which they probably don't want to bother if you run Linux.

That makes sense never thought of it that way.

[Weasel]

What's illogical about wanting native support in games?

When the game runs perfectly fine in a different framework (sorry, I mean "non native"), then it's completely illogical to request it in a different form just because you want it so. That's a completely emotional argument. I mean, the subject was about DOOM, which runs perfectly fine in Wine, and by perfectly fine, I don't mean "with a performance drop", I mean literally almost the same (or even the same) as on Windows. Check videos and comparisons.

Reason I quoted "non native" is that Wine is as native as it gets, even the name says it's not an emulator. It's like a framework of libraries (Windows compatibility layer) which is no different than all the rest of your libraries in the system.

I know what's next: complain about the footprint of wine or not wanting to install it or "cruft" or whatever. If you squashfs wine, it's like 100MB at most, and the subject was about DOOM, which is like 60GB, yeah I'm sure 100MB is so significant when the game is 60GB.

[Leopard]

When the game runs perfectly fine in a different framework (sorry, I mean "non native"), then it's completely illogical to request it in a different form just because you want it so. That's a completely emotional argument. I mean, the subject was about DOOM, which runs perfectly fine in Wine, and by perfectly fine, I don't mean "with a performance drop", I mean literally almost the same (or even the same) as on Windows. Check videos and comparisons.

Reason I quoted "non native" is that Wine is as native as it gets, even the name says it's not an emulator. It's like a framework of libraries (Windows compatibility layer) which is no different than all the rest of your libraries in the system.

I know what's next: complain about the footprint of wine or not wanting to install it or "cruft" or whatever. If you squashfs wine, it's like 100MB at most, and the subject was about DOOM, which is like 60GB, yeah I'm sure 100MB is so significant when the game is 60GB.

Problem is not running the game in a different framework.

Wine always open to regressions , incompabilities , rendering issues , hickups , crashes etc.

Sorry but i can't spend money to an unguarenteed compability , performance etc.

I'm not against to Wine wrapped games either , as long they work as they should.

Market visibility only comes with apps that certainly lists Linux as a compatible OS. No matter they run in a wine wrap or native.

TL DR ; supporting apps and their developers that have good Linux builds is not bad.

Buying unsupported apps on Linux won't change devs or companies stance about Linux. Because you bought it with knowing it is not compatible , they got their money anyway. Why would they add extra Linux team? They're selling it to you anyway.

[dimko]

Question was rhetorical. I obviously know there's a lot of purists who have reasons that are more emotional than logical.

Can't really blame devs for not catering to their emotions tho.

I am not purist, purely logical reasons. I dont support wine based products, so developers have less initiative to release wine based products or no Linux port all together.

How is that purist - no idea.

[Weasel]

Wine always open to regressions , incompabilities , rendering issues , hickups , crashes etc.

Oh really?

Why don't you start demanding Linux version of DOOM when the game fails to work due to regression in Wine then? See? That's the logical thing to do. You know, if you spent money on the game, you can always just... use the old Wine version that works... amazing.

(and you speak as if normal linux libs don't have any regressions... but at least the Wine devs are serious about regressions)

I am not purist, purely logical reasons. I dont support wine based products

So where's the logic for this reason?

"Liking" or "disliking" something is emotional btw. (e.g. I dislike Wine because whatever)

[Leopard]

Oh really?

Why don't you start demanding Linux version of DOOM when the game fails to work due to regression in Wine then? See? That's the logical thing to do. You know, if you spent money on the game, you can always just... use the old Wine version that works... amazing.

(and you speak as if normal linux libs don't have any regressions... but at least the Wine devs are serious about regressions)

So where's the logic for this reason?

"Liking" or "disliking" something is emotional btw. (e.g. I dislike Wine because whatever)

Why i didn't start to demand Linux version of it:

1-) They didn't care user interest at this low market share

2-) I don't own a legit copy of Doom actually , just played it via a repack through Wine. So i didn't give money to complain about it.

Not everybody needs to jump between Wine versions , i always use the Staging and if it works that's cool and if it is not i will only submit a report about it.

Because my Linux games are primary gaming source for me. Every Wine depending title is an additional bonus.

[dimko]

Oh really?
So where's the logic for this reason?

"Liking" or "disliking" something is emotional btw. (e.g. I dislike Wine because whatever)

I dare you to quote me i said I like/dislike something.

Reasons: if I have 2 games. Depend on version of Wine one or another doesn't work. Which makes Wine bad solution. Also, with Wine come standard Windows security vulnerabilities.

[Weasel]

Why i didn't start to demand Linux version of it:

1-) They didn't care user interest at this low market share

2-) I don't own a legit copy of Doom actually , just played it via a repack through Wine. So i didn't give money to complain about it.

Not everybody needs to jump between Wine versions , i always use the Staging and if it works that's cool and if it is not i will only submit a report about it.

Because my Linux games are primary gaming source for me. Every Wine depending title is an additional bonus.

Well FWIW, serious regressions are pretty rare (i.e. that render an application unuseable or unplayable).

Of course you should test to see if the game works on your system first before you buy it (or if you buy it, and it doesn't work, refund it, Steam for example allows that). That is irrespective of Wine, it's standard practice, even on Windows (much more on Linux).

And if it doesn't work in the future when you update wine, just revert to older version? Wine recently only really installs itself into /opt/wine-staging or /opt/wine or whatever. Backing it up or moving it is very simple, or having multiple ones installed (if you use package manager, just copy it somewhere else first... even if you "update" it).

I dare you to quote me i said I like/dislike something.

Reasons: if I have 2 games. Depend on version of Wine one or another doesn't work. Which makes Wine bad solution. Also, with Wine come standard Windows security vulnerabilities.

Well man, that like/dislike was just an example, since I did use "e.g." which means "example given"...

Btw you're wrong. Wine doesn't "come" with security vulnerabilities, it just allows you to run Windows malware. Unless the game you run is malware, in which case even a Linux port would be malware (because it's the same game and the same code), then what you said makes no sense.

In fact I'd argue that a native port is even *more* dangerous, because then if the game *does* contain malware, it's made and ported specifically for Linux. In Wine's case, it probably is made for Windows, so if you e.g. remove the Z:\ drive, it will fail to find most of your files to spy on, scan, ransom, or whatever. Of course, it *can* find them from Wine, but it doesn't mean it's coded to handle Wine's case. A native Linux game is definitely coded to run on Linux tho, so it's even less secure.

tl;dr Wine provides more "obscurity" to an application than a native port so it's practically safer, but theoretically it's just as safe at least.


BTW Wine doesn't "break" on new versions, that's considered regressions, their aim is to make one version useable on everything (but it's a stretch goal). Lately I've rarely (if ever) found reasons to use old Wine versions. And in this case DOOM works fine so there's no issue.

[audir8]

You're entitled to do what you want with your money, but don't be under the illusion that it's helping increase Linux market share more than wine. There are 3 main reasons that I can think of:

1) If you don't have a console, and want to play a game only playable through Wine... File a wine bug report or appdb update to make it better. You can even tell the developer you're using Wine, most except Bethesda will acknowledge it and will or won't officially support it for xyz reasons.
2) You'll find quite a few like Stardock want to bring games to Linux, but just don't have the resources. So, buying their game and hoping they'll release a Linux version in the next generation is a fine thing to do.
3) Emulators for every type of game platform exist, why shouldn't people use Wine to run windows games? This will remain true over the short, medium and long term as long as windows exists.

Many reasons to support wine, almost no rational ones to not support it unless you don't understand software, or can't look at the big picture. Linux is a complete platform, not just a gaming, server, development or desktop platform.

Edit: I'm not against commercial apps for sale on Linux, if it sounded that way. Just talking about the case of buying windows games and running them on wine.

[Weasel]

3) Emulators for every type of game platform exist, why shouldn't people use Wine to run windows games?

I fully agree with your post, but just a nitpick. Wine is not an emulator (the name itself is a recursive acronym for that these days). It's a compatibility layer (i.e. it implements Windows libraries on Linux).

Sometimes you have to emulate behavior due to limitations of Linux userland, but not the instruction set or anything.