Ubuntu Linux Evaluating x86-64-v3 Based Build - AVX & Newer Intel/AMD CPUs

[CommunityMember]

Especially when this has very little improvement. It's not worth breaking so many systems.

Well, then, as a multi-million dollar paying customer of Canonical Ubuntu server, make your position known to your TAM and account rep. That is the way to influence these decisions.

[CommunityMember]

You forget about homelabs. I have a bunch of old Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge systems in mine, running Ubuntu Server. I'll switch them to Debian if necessary.

Are you a paying customer of Canonical Ubuntu Server? If so, contact your TAM and account rep and indicate your concerns (for money matters).

[pWe00Iri3e7Z9lHOX2Qx]

Again, people misusing ISA feature levels. They were intended to be used for multi-targeting libraries, so you don't have to shut people out.

I wonder how SuSE is getting on with that:

https://www.phoronix.com/news/openSUSE-TW-x86-64-v3-RPM

Any updates, Michael ?

Here's what Tumbleweed installed for me...

foo@STRIX:~> zypper se -si 64-v3
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...

S | Name                            | Type    | Version                 | Arch   | Repository
--+---------------------------------+---------+-------------------------+--------+----------------------
i | libboost_thread1_83_0-x86-64-v3 | package | 1.83.0-1.1              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libbrotlicommon1-x86-64-v3      | package | 1.1.0-1.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libbrotlidec1-x86-64-v3         | package | 1.1.0-1.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libbrotlienc1-x86-64-v3         | package | 1.1.0-1.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libbz2-1-x86-64-v3              | package | 1.0.8-5.8               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libdb-4_8-x86-64-v3             | package | 4.8.30-42.4             | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libexiv2-28-x86-64-v3           | package | 0.28.1-1.1              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libFLAC12-x86-64-v3             | package | 1.4.3-1.3               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libgcrypt20-x86-64-v3           | package | 1.10.3-2.1              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libhogweed6-x86-64-v3           | package | 3.9.1-2.3               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libiscsi9-x86-64-v3             | package | 1.19.0+git.20231114-1.1 | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libjpeg8-x86-64-v3              | package | 8.2.2-76.2              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libjxl0_8-x86-64-v3             | package | 0.8.2-2.2               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | liblz4-1-x86-64-v3              | package | 1.9.4-2.6               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | liblzma5-x86-64-v3              | package | 5.4.5-1.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | liblzo2-2-x86-64-v3             | package | 2.10-8.4                | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libminizip1-x86-64-v3           | package | 1.3-1.1                 | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libmng2-x86-64-v3               | package | 2.0.3-3.6               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libmp3lame0-x86-64-v3           | package | 3.100-5.7               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libnettle8-x86-64-v3            | package | 3.9.1-2.3               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libopenjp2-7-x86-64-v3          | package | 2.5.0-3.7               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libopenssl3-x86-64-v3           | package | 3.1.4-2.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libpng16-16-x86-64-v3           | package | 1.6.40-1.2              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libpython3_11-1_0-x86-64-v3     | package | 3.11.6-1.2              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libsqlite3-0-x86-64-v3          | package | 3.44.1-1.1              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libtalloc2-x86-64-v3            | package | 2.4.1-1.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libtommath1-x86-64-v3           | package | 1.2.1-1.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libvorbis0-x86-64-v3            | package | 1.3.7-4.2               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libvorbisenc2-x86-64-v3         | package | 1.3.7-4.2               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libvorbisfile3-x86-64-v3        | package | 1.3.7-4.2               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libxmlb2-x86-64-v3              | package | 0.3.14-1.2              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libz1-x86-64-v3                 | package | 1.3-1.1                 | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | libzstd1-x86-64-v3              | package | 1.5.5-3.5               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | python3-talloc-x86-64-v3        | package | 2.4.1-1.1               | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | python311-base-x86-64-v3        | package | 3.11.6-1.2              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
i | python311-x86-64-v3             | package | 3.11.6-1.1              | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)

And here are the other x86-64-v3 packages in the repos that I don't have installed.

foo@STRIX:~> zypper se -su 64-v3
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...

S | Name                                     | Type    | Version     | Arch   | Repository
--+------------------------------------------+---------+-------------+--------+--------------------------
  | libbabl-0_1-0-x86-64-v3                  | package | 0.1.106-1.3 | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libblosc2-2-x86-64-v3                    | package | 2.11.3-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_atomic1_83_0-x86-64-v3          | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_container1_83_0-x86-64-v3       | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_date_time1_83_0-x86-64-v3       | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_filesystem1_83_0-x86-64-v3      | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_graph1_83_0-x86-64-v3           | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_graph_parallel1_83_0-x86-64-v3  | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_iostreams1_83_0-x86-64-v3       | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_json1_83_0-x86-64-v3            | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_locale1_83_0-x86-64-v3          | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_math1_83_0-x86-64-v3            | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_mpi1_83_0-x86-64-v3             | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_nowide1_83_0-x86-64-v3          | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_program_options1_83_0-x86-64-v3 | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_python-py3-1_83_0-x86-64-v3     | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_random1_83_0-x86-64-v3          | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_regex1_83_0-x86-64-v3           | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_serialization1_83_0-x86-64-v3   | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_stacktrace1_83_0-x86-64-v3      | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_system1_83_0-x86-64-v3          | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_test1_83_0-x86-64-v3            | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_type_erasure1_83_0-x86-64-v3    | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_url1_83_0-x86-64-v3             | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libboost_wave1_83_0-x86-64-v3            | package | 1.83.0-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libbzip3-0-x86-64-v3                     | package | 1.3.2-1.2   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libclzma-suse0-x86-64-v3                 | package | 22.01-1.5   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libeverest-x86-64-v3                     | package | 3.5.1-1.1   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libFLAC++10-x86-64-v3                    | package | 1.4.3-1.3   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libgcrypt-devel-x86-64-v3                | package | 1.10.3-2.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libjsoncpp25-x86-64-v3                   | package | 1.9.5-2.5   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libleveldb1-x86-64-v3                    | package | 1.23-2.11   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libmbedcrypto7-x86-64-v3                 | package | 2.28.6-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libmbedcrypto15-x86-64-v3                | package | 3.5.1-1.1   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libmbedtls14-x86-64-v3                   | package | 2.28.6-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libmbedtls20-x86-64-v3                   | package | 3.5.1-1.1   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libmbedx509-1-x86-64-v3                  | package | 2.28.6-1.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libmbedx509-6-x86-64-v3                  | package | 3.5.1-1.1   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libmopac7-1-x86-64-v3                    | package | 1.15-8.6    | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libp256m-x86-64-v3                       | package | 3.5.1-1.1   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libpng16-compat-devel-x86-64-v3          | package | 1.6.40-1.2  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libpng16-devel-x86-64-v3                 | package | 1.6.40-1.2  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libpython3_12-1_0-x86-64-v3              | package | 3.12.0-2.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libscrypt0-x86-64-v3                     | package | 1.22-1.4    | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libsqlcipher-3_42_0-0-x86-64-v3          | package | 4.5.5-1.1   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libtesseract5-x86-64-v3                  | package | 5.3.1-1.3   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libtree-sitter0-x86-64-v3                | package | 0.20.8-2.4  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libturbojpeg0-x86-64-v3                  | package | 8.2.2-76.2  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libunrar6_2_12-x86-64-v3                 | package | 6.2.12-1.3  | x86_64 | Main Repository (NON-OSS)
  | libyara10-x86-64-v3                      | package | 4.4.0-1.1   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libzopfli1-x86-64-v3                     | package | 1.0.3-2.3   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | libzopflipng1-x86-64-v3                  | package | 1.0.3-2.3   | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | python312-base-x86-64-v3                 | package | 3.12.0-2.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)
  | python312-x86-64-v3                      | package | 3.12.0-2.1  | x86_64 | Main Repository (OSS)​

[stormcrow]

All these posts to Phoronix... the nerd outrage, the entitlement. And yet, none of it matters. Unless you're a paying for their support contracts you're not a customer. Not even if you use Ubuntu Server. You want your opinion to matter? Pay for the right to register your opinion with Canonical. Not a paying customer means your opinion is as useless as any other random commenter to any other random forums.

[pepoluan]

All the raging people here, do any of you actually read Canonical's blog post?

Canonical explicitly explained what they will be doing, and also explicitly stated they are very aware that some newer CPUs from Intel does not support extensions released years earlier.

It's all still an experiment. Canonical says so in the blog post, quite emphatically. Even warning that if you go the v3 route you may not receive any updates, because it's an experiment! They are still quantifying the benefits and drawbacks of using v3 as the baseline, and invite people to submit objective results.

[TemplarGR]

In my opinion all major distros should offer a v3 build as an option, now that the 32bit options have been ditched. We used to have 2 different builds for years, it is not that difficult to offer a v3 option for those who can run it, and the normal x64 for everyone else. For about 5-10 years, then make v3 the default. Everyone should have a v3 cpu by then, if not, well, they can stick to older distros.

[avis]

Meanwhile gcc's -mtune option still exists. Not sure why it can't be used to satisfy everyone.

[ms178]

Are you blaming people for buying the only hardware available to them when they need it where the only alternative is to go without?

What do you recommend these people do instead? Build their own cpu from scratch or something?

Lol, all these people that seriously care about a niche that rounds to zero, especially when being left out running an experimental version of Ubuntu server? I dispute the notion that there were no alternatives for these people. Coder's counter example is as sane as saying that "There are no alternatives to Intel CPUs on Socket 1700!". There are always alternatives, if they were fine to buy that shitty Intel hardware back in the day, they now have to feed their stock holders with their money again (repeating the same mistake possibly, due to lack of AVX-512 in the current Intel desktop lineup). That's appearently what you get for staying a loyal Intel customer, you get products with a shorter product life in comparison to the competition. If people fail to realize this when they make their purchase decision, they get what they deserved and now pay the prize (either in having to buy newer hardware or to change the distro sooner or later). (But hey, there are a lot of people that still buy 8 GB - 12 GB VRAM GPUs from Nvidia for a lot of money these days. Some people cannot look forward appearently or learn from the past - you don't need a crystal ball to wonder how future games with AI workloads will cope with that VRAM limitation.).

[scineram]

Ubuntu already offers i386, x86_64_v1, OpenPower, and S390X builds. Is it that much more difficult for them to add in some x86_64 v2, v3, and v4 builds?.

Like Red Hat and Suse, for now they sould switch v1 to v2 and kill i386. Simple as.

[coder]

Well, then, as a multi-million dollar paying customer of Canonical Ubuntu server, make your position known to your TAM and account rep. That is the way to influence these decisions.

If Canonical pays too little heed to the community, it will suddenly find itself with fewer open source users, which form a sort of feeder pipeline for those who ultimately become paying users.

Canonical has done many things to alienate the community, usually with reason and for some perceived strategic advantage. This is one time they gain very little upside, yet will do real harm to their community engagement.

Just as Canonical might see free users are parasites, it's also a sort of parasite to Debian. And a lot of disgruntled free users can pretty easily switch to Debian, or some other derived distro.