Microsoft Is Writing Its Own Wayland Compositor As Part Of WSL2 GUI Efforts

[Volta]

And no, I never said anything about market share (or whether market share implies something else). Putting words in someone else's mouth is highly inappropriate.

You didn't clarify what you mean. Other parts are just opinions. Android is a great example of usability nightmare. It's even worse than Windows UX. For me Fedora is the most usable OS, but it doesn't matter. It's important who controls ecosystem and Ms is an evil - another MS Android won't help us.

[wizard69]

Microsoft has understand the potentiality of Linux provided by Wayland and is going to realize the bets Linux operating system. After this project is realized the market sharing of Linux OS will be reduced to the 0,1%. It's the natural aftermath of age-old ineptitude and fragmentation of linux developers.

I'm not sure you can suggest that Linux developers suffer from ineptitude but they certainly suffer from fragmentation. The use of JavaScript and a reliance on C for app development though might be seen as ineptitude though.

As for MicroSoft realizing the best Linux all one has to do is to look at Windows 10 to realize that they have miles to go to catch up. I'm not extremely worried but I do believe it is time for the Linux community to do something that encourages rapid app development. Sort of like the massive change Apple has made by going from Objective C to Swift and to SwiftUI. The kernel is great but what hurts Linux is the availability of app, especially easily created apps

[vladpetric]

Android is a phone UX. While I was hoping that it'd develop into a desktop/tablet hybrid UX/OS, it didn't.

Things crashing with a non-trivial frequency isn't just an opinion, e.g., when I run atom through flatpak. Obviously, it's pretty critical for an editor to work stably, so I more or less gave up on it.

And I can add a lot more stuff - inconsistent copy paste between apps, x11 being a bastardized technology with no real replacement at the time (people talk about security, without realizing how insecure by design x11 is).

You didn't clarify what you mean. Other parts are just opinions. Android is a great example of usability nightmare. It's even worse than Windows UX. For me Fedora is the most usable OS, but it doesn't matter. It's important who controls ecosystem and Ms is an evil.

[Scellow]

Microsoft ❤ Open Source, that is why everything announced so far is Closed Source 😍😍

[JustinTurdeau]

Microsoft ❤ Open Source, that is why everything announced so far is Closed Source 😍😍

Microsoft ❤ parasitism and stealing other people's innovations. That's all they've done throughout their entire existence.

[Volta]

Android is a phone UX. While I was hoping that it'd develop into a desktop/tablet hybrid UX/OS, it didn't.

Things crashing with a non-trivial frequency isn't just an opinion, e.g., when I run atom through flatpak. Obviously, it's pretty critical for an editor to work stably, so I more or less gave up on it.

And I can add a lot more stuff - inconsistent copy paste between apps, x11 being a bastardized technology with no real replacement at the time (people talk about security, without realizing how insecure by design x11 is).

X was a dead end. What I am seeing is Linux desktop on Wayland, systemd, built around Gtk4. Flatpak needs to mature. However, Atom is java based afaik and maybe that's a culprit.

[polarathene]

polarathene

OOXML, Silverlight, DirectX.

How is DX got anything to do with Windows crushing Linux via EEE? It has a proprietary API mmmk, devs on Windows write software for it, largely because OpenGL support on Windows was not as nice, all prior to Vulkan. Apple does the same with Metal, hell they've gone to extremes on their OS, if you want to point at lock-down, Apple takes the cake over Windows, lack of DX support isn't threatening Apple with EEE is it, why isn't Apple ever relevant and only MS with your EEE whining? (I understand the history, but what really makes others like Apple not applicable to this bullshit?)

Only now is there a DX contribution, and it's only intended for Windows users via WSL, they have no desire or expectations for anyone to develop Linux software that depends on DX. Yes there is talks about supporting the driver on linux better without need of a Windows host, but we've had shit like that via WINE/DXVK where those projects are praised, Windows does it and all of a sudden get out your EEE pitchforks? Dafuq.

Silverlight...yeah big bad terrible threat that was, dead. Flash did a better job, that ain't all open-source, where's the EEE cries for Adobe?

OOXML, I can't comment on much, don't see how it matters though. What was the actual damage/threat it caused? Were you using it with your open-source document software? Were others you collaborated with? Were they on linux too or did you receive from Windows Office? If the latter, would receiving a prior format specifc to Office had made the situation any better? Incompatibility between versions happens, even with open-source stuff, not necessarily evil, can just be bad architecture. I don't know the full story about that, so maybe there's more to it if MS was found to actually intentionally cause problems to fuck with non-Windows users. Still Linux and the open-source world stands strong, so I ask again, what real difference did it make?

Now show me good practices from Ms.

Define good practices?

They've contributed plenty to open-source (not Linux specifically), generally for projects that benefit MS and it's ecosystem, but not necessarily causing any EEE thing. "Oh no, I made my software offerings slightly better to address the needs of users and I even did so with open-source projects instead of proprietary, the horror"... I see nothing wrong with a business that chooses to open-source software that happens to be related to what's of value to their business.

Visual Studio Code is a particularly nice one, you don't need to have anything to do with MS to enjoy that.

Github, while not made / contributed by MS, after their acquisition they haven't made the platform worse (well can't say I'm a fan of the new notification page design), if anything they've made it more accessible, free private repos for example(yes Gitlab offers that too, and is a great service in itself), but they're doing good with it aren't they?

So what is MS doing that's going to somehow Extinguish Linux? If they want to contribute shit, let them go nuts, we've got good maintainers that will properly review those contributions, and an ever watchful eye of the paranoid EEE users for anything naughty who'll be sure to let everyone know about it. 5G is non-ionizing, the earth is round, 100% of deaths preventable from a vaccine can surprisingly be prevented via vaccine, EEE isn't a realistic threat to Linux.

[vladpetric]

X was a dead end. What I am seeing is Linux desktop on Wayland, systemd, built around Gtk4. Flatpak needs to mature. However, Atom is java based afaik and maybe that's a culprit.

Sure, I'd love to see Wayland mature (honestly, who doesn't ... ). Is it there yet? As in default desktop environment? No, not yet.

With respect to Wayland I've been hearing the word "soon" for the last 8 years. I'm really hoping that 2021 is finally the year Wayland is default.

"Atom is a desktop application built with HTML, JavaScript, CSS, and Node.js integration" (from atom.io). Though honestly I don't care too much about that.

[polarathene]

Atom is java based afaik and maybe that's a culprit.

Atom is JS on top of Electron/Chromium (C++).

[Vistaus]

I just wish Microsoft made it possible to write cross-platform GUI applications on .NET Core that works on Linux. It is possible today with the third-party framework Avalonia. But it would be nice if it was officially supported in any way, such as Windows Presentation Foundation (WPF) or UWP or WinUI.

Microsoft is phasing out UWP, so they're not going to support that: https://liliputing.com/2020/05/proje...dows-apps.html