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Microsoft Is Writing Its Own Wayland Compositor As Part Of WSL2 GUI Efforts

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  • #71
    I hope this means that they'll enable ozone/wayland on Edge, vscode, Teams and azure data studios.

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    • #72
      Originally posted by Volta View Post

      I'm playing Steam games without X, so?
      Really, without xwayland?

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      • #73
        This is amazing!
        Maybe now we can see contributions to Wayland and Weston from Microsoft.
        Maybe now we can finally have a stable Wayland shell (because GNOME Shell isn't all that stable).

        Will it be possible to run this Microsoft Wayland compositor stand-alone? Or is it only useful when running Linux inside Windows through WSL2?

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        • #74
          Originally posted by kpedersen View Post
          Hmm, if RDP works well with their wayland compositor... Linux has absolutely lost the battle when it comes to enterprise and thin client deployments.
          AFAIK, Gnome was looking to implementing this feature too - allowing you to RDP into gnome.

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          • #75
            Reading this thread is funny. Today, after 25 years of not giving the slightest thought to what Linus Torvalds thinks about GNU/Linux desktop environments, suddenly I'm supposed to care very deeply. Because Windows does everything right and never has any instability. Or something.

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            • #76
              Originally posted by vladpetric View Post

              I've been using and developing with Linux for roughly 25 years now. While up to Vista, Windows desktop had been far less stable than Linux, after Windows 7 things changed a lot.

              And yes, fragmentation is still insane, most Linux desktop apps look different and have inconsistent shortcuts, and no one really seems to give a FF.
              Yeah and least of all who cares about consistent look and feel is Gnome. That's certainly true. But open source isn't a dictatorship and projects can feel free to do what they want and how they want to do it. If projects like Gnome don't give a care about consistency, then use KDE which definitely does care. Options abound. Make a choice.

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              • #77
                Originally posted by vladpetric View Post

                Windows has a pretty low bar, indeed.

                The sad part is that Linux desktop manages to not even get above that bar. Even copy paste doesn't work consistently across apps in Linux.

                And the default and most popular environment for Linux desktop is still X11. Bastardized technology, but there's nothing better yet.
                Yeah exactly, there is nothing better than x11. That's kinda the whole point.

                EDIT: Calling the evolution of a software project "bastardized" is kinda stupid. Yes, x11 evolved over time, it had to. Obviously. It's the reason why it's still the best display system available today, still....
                Last edited by duby229; 05-20-2020, 04:00 PM.

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                • #78
                  Now you have the proof that microsoft loves Linux .
                  Possible Future:
                  Windows = The better implemented Linux
                  Maybe even Windows for Android....
                  Then Linux will have like nearly 100% market share
                  Maybe Linus will become a full time microsoft employee

                  Ok, not very likely that scenario, but it would be a lot of fun .

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                  • #79
                    Originally posted by frank007 View Post

                    Really, without xwayland?
                    With XWayland of course. XWayland isn't going away, but X is no longer needed. XWayland does the job. X is bloated, insecure mess that was holding Linux back for a long. However, there were no replacement..
                    Last edited by Volta; 05-20-2020, 04:43 PM.

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                    • #80
                      Originally posted by duby229 View Post

                      Yeah exactly, there is nothing better than x11. That's kinda the whole point.

                      EDIT: Calling the evolution of a software project "bastardized" is kinda stupid. Yes, x11 evolved over time, it had to. Obviously. It's the reason why it's still the best display system available today, still....
                      Have you actually looked at the X11 architecture?

                      X11's design is so shitty that the people maintaining it have given up on reforming it, and instead work on Wayland. That's why I call it bastardized. It's insecure by design (an app can screw another app on the same system easily; granted there's a secure extension in Xorg, but proper security is rarely achieved by adding an extension).

                      You really should watch this video from 2013:

                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIctzAQOe44

                      You can skip to 7:20, though he explains in that time why he's qualified

                      Quotes:

                      (about x11) "A mechanism for any client to enforce its idiot wishes on everyone"

                      "Programming X is like reading one of those French philosophers where afterwards you start wondering whether you know anything for sure" Thomas Thurman

                      "Why would you fix anything if you can work around it?"

                      There's more, but I won't spoil it.

                      This video also gives a clear idea as to how disorganized and corrupt free software projects can be.

                      Hopefully Wayland is fully functional before we get fusion power.

                      Look, if you're a true believer in X11 I don't think I can convince you otherwise (Koolaid and all).
                      Last edited by vladpetric; 05-20-2020, 04:58 PM.

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