Arch-Based Manjaro Users Express Concern Over Update Strategy

[dungeon]

As a Debian user, i think i have brainbreaking after reading this

https://wiki.manjaro.org/index.php?title=Access_the_Testing_Repositories

So if i understand this right in Manjaro stable repo is what is testing repo in Debian, testing is what is unstable in Debian (which is actually stable Arch? i guess) and their unstable is what is experimental in Debian, sounds like that to me...

Really why they use same naming for repos like Debian, but are actually for different purposes that sounds to me someone wants to make some sort of distro mimikry

[Daktyl198]

As a Debian user, i think i have brainbreaking after reading this

https://wiki.manjaro.org/index.php?title=Access_the_Testing_Repositories

So if i understand this right in Manjaro stable repo is what is testing repo in Debian, testing is what is unstable in Debian (which is actually stable Arch? i guess) and their unstable is what is experimental in Debian, sounds like that to me...

Really why they use same naming for repos like Debian, but are actually for different purposes that sounds to me someone wants to make some sort of distro mimikry

No:
Unstable == Direct sync from Arch's repos (usually twice a day), but includes some of their own packages (mhwd, etc)
Testing == Packages that passed through Unstable without any immediately noticeable breakages. Here is where the majority of the testing goes on, as it's almost guaranteed to not fuck up your boot/login (Unstable would catch those... Hello there, Gnome 3.12/Cinnamon 2.2 update!), but some things may still be messed up.
Stable == Packages that are 95% guaranteed to not break your system. Updates to this repo usually comes in a (somewhat) monthly update called "Update packs". This is the default repository for Manjaro.

[korrode]

I wonder how many Manjaro users got viruses or got their system hacked in the 5 weeks without an update?


Oh wait, that's right; none.

[dungeon]

No:
Unstable == Direct sync from Arch's repos (usually twice a day), but includes some of their own packages (mhwd, etc)
Testing == Packages that passed through Unstable without any immediately noticeable breakages. Here is where the majority of the testing goes on, as it's almost guaranteed to not fuck up your boot/login (Unstable would catch those... Hello there, Gnome 3.12/Cinnamon 2.2 update!), but some things may still be messed up.
Stable == Packages that are 95% guaranteed to not break your system. Updates to this repo usually comes in a (somewhat) monthly update called "Update packs". This is the default repository for Manjaro.

So that i what i said, their "stable" is what Debian calling "testing" (but with more similar delays to what LMDE do), while there is no enterprise quality stable and old-stable repos which Debian has

[korrode]

Oh, and Michael:

Glad to see you post real news, like the details of our recent release candidates for 0.8.11, and don't cater to the whims of random people who email you with opinions that are not that of most of our users...

Oh wait, that's not what happened. The opposite happened. Because you post sensationalist bullshit.

You just like posting shit like this because i told you off when you literally helped trolls to attempt to troll us, right?

[alexcortes]

I never understood what the Arch users think is the source to be elitist about that system. I used to use Arch until around four years ago when I switched to Gentoo before I was planning, most because of the near daily system breakage and the community who was starting to be what they are now. As far I like the Arch usability it was never more than a toy for me, VERY unreliable for any serious usage and doesn't have a fraction of the customization capabilities of Gentoo, at least not in a simple way.

Cheers!

[Avogadro]

I wonder how many Manjaro users got viruses or got their system hacked in the 5 weeks without an update?


Oh wait, that's right; none.

Users are entitled to get updates, especially security updates, otherwise there's a good chance their going to leave. I would. It doesn't matter if no one got hacked this time, what about the next time the developers are twittling their thumbs and thanks to this incident someone decides to take advantage of the thousands of vulnerable users.

There's already been a lot of concerns and controversy over how Manjaro so called "Maintains" their packages. This just solidifies for me that they don't have the savyness or apparent manpower anymore since their mass exodus to keep maintaining it. They've already had to drop the second most popular official release.

But thanks for opening up here with such strong sarcasm, it really displays your elegance.

[korrode]

Users are entitled to get updates

No one is "entitled" to anything when they get something for free that explicitly states it has no warranty.

especially security updates, otherwise there's a good chance their going to leave. I would.It doesn't matter if no one got hacked this time, what about the next time the developers are twittling their thumbs and thanks to this incident someone decides to take advantage of the thousands of vulnerable users.

There's already been a lot of concerns and controversy over how Manjaro so called "Maintains" their packages. This just solidifies for me that they don't have the savyness or apparent manpower anymore since their mass exodus to keep maintaining it. They've already had to drop the second most popular official release.

There was no "mass" exodus, that was a troll who managed to trick Michael into posting what he wanted.
Manjaro now has more repo/package maintainers than it did back then (back then there was 3, now there is 5).

Openbox got dropped as an official release because there simply wasn't sufficient interest from the team.
One team member has been working on it now and it will continue as a community edition.

But thanks for opening up here with such strong sarcasm, it really displays your elegance.

You're welcome.

[hr]

The fact simply is that the 5 weeks of no updates was an abnormality. It's normally around 2 weeks between Stable updates and this year we've pushed perceived high-importance security fixes (heartbleed, shellshock, etc.) to Stable branch faster than many other distros did, and starting in the new year we're building Firefox ourselves and updating Stable with new versions more promptly.

[Avogadro]

No one is "entitled" to anything when they get something for free that explicitly states it has no warranty.


There was no "mass" exodus, that was a troll who managed to trick Michael into posting what he wanted.
Manjaro now has more repo/package maintainers than it did back then (back then there was 3, now there is 5).

Openbox got dropped as an official release because there simply wasn't sufficient interest from the team.
One team member has been working on it now and it will continue as a community edition.


You're welcome.

[hr]

The fact simply is that the 5 weeks of no updates was an abnormality. It's normally around 2 weeks between Stable updates and this year we've pushed perceived high-importance security fixes (heartbleed, shellshock, etc.) to Stable branch faster than many other distros did, and starting in the new year we're building Firefox ourselves and updating Stable with new versions more promptly.

If you're a team member, then why don't you provide us with "accurate" information as to your counter claims?

I'd be very interested to find out just exactly what is afoot over at Arch's GUI.

Personally, I think that Manjaro is going down the toilet since the few people who actually knew what was going on left. I'm not talking about the mouth breathers who are on the team that walk around and maybe change a line of code, wrongly, once in a month. I mean the people who actually developed, in a real programming language. As I recall, there was only a handful, and one of them who left in the exodus.

Or perhaps Manjaro just doesn't give a crap about it's users, or the claims they make all over their website. Like you said, no one got hacked, so they shouldn't complain?

I can see why people are leaving the distro with bristling management like yourself. I'll stick to Arch myself thank you, where atleast I know I'll get my updates. Plus I don't like the crapware that is spins.

But if you have a valid reason why there were no updates, and one that isn't "All five of our package managers were on vacation" then maybe I'll shut up. But if I know Manjaro, you probably just pulled three people out of the community who didn't drool on themselves when you said PKGBUILD, and gave them package rights. And the only person who actually maintains the repos, Phil, was on vacation, and you were off screwing the pooch also.

Am I ballpark here?

[Daktyl198]

I'll stick to Arch myself thank you

See, the funny part about all this is that this one line, out of your entire post, sticks out the most. You are what is known as an "Arch Elitist", aka an asshole, who simply doesn't like that anybody would DARE create a distro based on Arch! Oh the humanity! How could they try and change something so perfect??

If you weren't so blinded by your superiority complex, you'd see that pretty much every word that you have said in this thread has been countered pretty fucking effectively. At this point you're just spouting insults to make us mad because there's nothing else you can do. You're powerless to stop Manjaro from becoming popular, but god be damned if you won't try by spreading lies and being generally angry that it exists.

Notice how literally nobody but elitist Arch users have a problem with Manjaro. Not the people who use it, not Gentoo users, not Ubuntu users... hell, not even the sane Arch users. Just people like you. If you were smart, you'd take a moment to reflect on that...