Canonical Details Ubuntu 24.04 Desktop Plans + Ongoing X11 Sunsetting Discussions

[oiaohm]

This list is incredibly old and terribly out of date. Nearly all of the issues listed here have been fixed since the 545.29.02 driver.

That what I get by going by Nvidia latest.txt.

https://download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86_64/535.146.02/README/wayland-issues.html

Compare the two.

https://download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86_64/545.29.06/README/wayland-issues.html

First section" NVIDIA Driver Limitations" is 8 vs 6 known issues, So that not nearly all fixed.

Section "Wayland Protocol or Compositor Limitations" is exactly the same nothing had changed.

It get worse of course.

Variable display refresh rate capabilities such as G-Sync are supported on Volta or newer GPUs with Wayland. Older GPUs are not supported.

This issue they did not in fact fix they just deleted because they are not going to support older GPUs with the newer driver..

So in reality only 1 issue was fixed

Virtual reality displays, such as the SteamVR platform, require support for DRM display leasing which does not currently work.

The list I used is the current driver marked latest by Nvidia as in the Latest stable driver you are meant to install.

partcyborg really simple in fact to take a version number and look it up I used a newer version number than you quoted. So please don't claim nearly fixed when that not the case.

Yes the list I used was not "incredibly old and terribly out of date", The driver I used 535.146.02 only had a release date of 7 Dec 2023. The 545.29.06 was released 22 Nov 2023 and the 545.29.02 that you pointed to 31 Oct 2023. Sometimes using the newest Nvidia driver release kind of catches you out.

[mSparks]

.

https://download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86_64/545.29.06/README/wayland-issues.html

First section" NVIDIA Driver Limitations" is 8 vs 6 known issues, So that not nearly all fixed.

Without double checking, pretty sure you will find these are issues that will possibly never be fixed because they are intentional in the design of wayland, nvidia considers them issues, wayland devs consider them features.

[Panix]

Hasn't Wayland been in development for at least 15 years and still isn't ready? But, devs/distros etc. are abandoning working on X11 - so, they want to bring along a 'new' Display Server Protocol that still isn't ready - and then I wonder if someone will come along trying to invent/create yet another one - and other distros are just trying to catch up (e.g. Mint plus others). So organized.... lol That's the Linux world, in a nutshell - ppl being so fractured, things not fixed, no consensus and arguing about open standards.

[mSparks]

Hasn't Wayland been in development for at least 15 years and still isn't ready? But, devs/distros etc. are abandoning working on X11 - so, they want to bring along a 'new' Display Server Protocol that still isn't ready - and then I wonder if someone will come along trying to invent/create yet another one - and other distros are just trying to catch up (e.g. Mint plus others). So organized.... lol That's the Linux world, in a nutshell - ppl being so fractured, things not fixed, no consensus and arguing about open standards.

Windows 8 and Windows Phone did happen, it's not a problem restricted to Linux.

[MrCooper]

I wish there was a synergy/barrier equivalent for Wayland. This seems to me like an important function still missing. Unfortunately, it is not receiving much attention.

There are libei support patches for Input-Leap. There's a Fedora copr: https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/co...-ei-enabled

[TiberiusDuval]

Personally I do not care what graphics system is used as long as it works with my hardware. And no I'm not changing my hardware untill it gets too old to perform adequately.

[oiaohm]

Without double checking, pretty sure you will find these are issues that will possibly never be fixed because they are intentional in the design of wayland, nvidia considers them issues, wayland devs consider them features.

No this i you wild guessing.

https://download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86_64/545.29.06/README/wayland-issues.html

The driver limitations section " NVIDIA Driver Limitations" are parts Nvidia themselves admit are not Wayland protocol issues. That is still 6 problems.

Indirect GLX does not work with Xwayland because the Glamor rendering engine is not compatible with our EGL implementation.

This one in Wayland limitations is clearly Nvidia driver limitation of our EGL driver implementation does not support implicit sync opengl and this is why xepher breaks with Nvidia closed source drivers under X11 by the way.

Xwayland does not provide a suitable mechanism for our driver to synchronize application rendering with presentation, which can cause visual corruption in some circumstances.

This is what the heck AMD and Intel don't have this issue. Here a good question can Xwayland in fact answer that question the answer is no it cannot. How does Mesa3d take on the same problem . Uses the https://wayland.app/protocols/presentation-time part of the Wayland protocol. Just because you are running under Xwayland does not mean you cannot be talking to the wayland compositor as well.

SLI Mosaic and Frame Lock and Genlock. Yes this is two lines

All happen to fall under the same thing lest say I am sitting on a Linux terminal yes pure text based interface no X11 no Wayland loaded. Can you setup these features of a Nvidia card. The answer is a strict no. Is this a wayland limitation no. Is this a Nvidia driver limitation for not providing generic interfaces that don't depend on X11 hell yes. Yes you cannot use these features with Nvidia EGLDevice either. These two absolutely should be in driver limitations not Wayland limitations.

Swap Groups. -- This runs into the problem that Nvidia implementation disregards process memory separation. There is no EGL extension to use this feature either. Yes Nvidia EGLDevice does not work .

Advanced display pipeline features including warp and blend, pixel shift, and emulated YUV420. -- Key word here pipeline. These are features you find in AMD and Intel kernel DRM driver based around DMABUF and using DMABUF metadata. nvidia-drm is the part with the limitation here. So these should not be in Wayland limitation this is driver limitation. Also fun you find lack of control for these using Nvidia EGLDevice applications again as well.

Stereo rendering-- Serous grain of salt required. https://sr.ht/~bl4ckb0ne/wxrc/ Remember the first claim at the start of this five "not supported by any Wayland compositors or the Wayland protocol." This is absolutely not true for this there are Wayland compositors that support Stereo rendering. Just they mostly stick to AMD and Intel Interfaces kind of for the same reason no EGL interfaces to use the Nvidia parts. So driver limitation again.

The more you keep on going though that list Nvidia provided more they claim to be Wayland issues turn out not to be the case. There is one issue that kind of real about Xwayland but that issue applies to xepher, xming/xcygwin and xQuartz as well because the problem is because Xwayland is a nested X11 Server.

[oiaohm]

Hasn't Wayland been in development for at least 15 years and still isn't ready?

That ignores from 2010-2020 nvidia was pushing eglstreams. So 10 years of that development was basically stalled out by a party pushing a solution that could not work due to critical flaws.

Yes trying to write wayland protocol extensions that support the broken quirks eglstreams and gbm/dmabuf at the same time end up causing protocol after protocol extension to be unable to be merged.

Nvidia going GBM/DMABUF in 2020 sees Wayland development speed up massively.

But, devs/distros etc. are abandoning working on X11

As as distribution do you think you will get a percentage of the government Linux desktop market that pays really well if you don't have a lock screen that works.

X11 bare metal does not have a working locking screen.

This is the old show the money problem. For parties like Redhat, Suse and so on there is mostly not the money in it to keep bare metal X11 server alive.

Wayland focus on security over functionality is about winning the good paying government contracts for the likes of things like the predator drone control consoles.

Also another thing. Most distributions have left the work on xserver baremetal for Linux up to exactly 1 party being Redhat/IBM. So when Redhat/IBM decides not to they have no staff themselves to counter Redhat/IBM choices.

Yes it simple to reskin a distribution is a lot harder todo the core work.

[mSparks]

....does not work with Xwayland

That's Xwayland, not wayland.
And actually a Glamour bug rather than either.

Xwayland does not provide a

This is also Xwayland, not wayland.
And also an Xwayland "feature" rather than an nvidia bug.

You seem infatuated with Xwayland, but Xwayland only makes any sense if a real X11 WM isn't available, which is like never.

And you said it yourself already, if someone does ever write a wayland app you want to use just run it it in weston or cage.

[Freeasabird]

Hasn't Wayland been in development for at least 15 years and still isn't ready? But, devs/distros etc. are abandoning working on X11 - so, they want to bring along a 'new' Display Server Protocol that still isn't ready - and then I wonder if someone will come along trying to invent/create yet another one - and other distros are just trying to catch up (e.g. Mint plus others). So organized.... lol That's the Linux world, in a nutshell - ppl being so fractured, things not fixed, no consensus and arguing about open standards.

oh look sophisticles has another account. Troll