Mark Shuttleworth Makes More Comments On Ubuntu GNOME, Mir, Convergence

[Ranomier]

Ah. This is someone Too Important To Bother then. Very well, carry on...

XMir shares no code and no history with XWayland. Anyone can write a wikipedia article, including teeth-grinding triggered agenda pushers, but the code doesn't lie.

About to? Mir has been shipping with libinput for quite some time. Libinput didn't exist when the Mir project was started, so it used evdev directly, just like x.org did. There is no shame in adopting good libraries. None.

Mir uses the Android drivers. It also uses libhybris, and contributed a lot to upstream because it encountered a lot of problems in production. Nothing wrong with being a good free software citizen and contributing back code, unless you're Canonical and you're the target of a hater.

Before the development of Mir, Canonical participated in the development of Wayland. When it became more advantageous to create their own compositing display manager, Canonical moved its Wayland devs over to Mir. The Central Committee did not approve of that that as a part of their continuing five year plan, but Canonical shipped phones and tablets and Mir has been ready on the desktop for a few release cycles now. It doesn't sound like an unreasonable decision to me. Ubuntu also ships Wayland, so you have the choice.


I think you need to read the article and all of the posts, maybe get your facts straight, and perhaps think about why you think it's so important to you that someone else does what you want with their time and money.

Ok i have to correct me a littlebit. There maid 8 small commits.

[genstorm]

Read the article that this forum is the comment section for.

Yes, it is dead. Note that it does not imply everyone stops using it right now; but any driving force is gone, it was far from finished, anyone relying on it for future development would be stupid.

[misGnomer]

We sent more patches upstream just last week. That's active maintenance, but since the APIs have been stable for a couple of years there isn't a lot of churn. You're grasping at straws looking for flaws.

Why do you think a maintenance burden would be lower for a project just because a week has passed? The code is the same code.


Some of the first few posts in this thread were the kind of explicit toxic hate that Mark was talking about. I'm not being passive-agressive if I acknowledge that "fuck MIR and unity" is unencoded hate language. That people like me are "idiots" and "stupid." I've known hateful angry bullies all of my life, and I know ignoring them never makes them go away.

I really do get it. They hate.

"We sent..."

bregma Are you (officially) associated with Canonical/Ubuntu? It might be polite to mention it in a thread like this if you are.


Wrt. all the " hate speech", you will always find a small number of vocal moaners in public forums and by engaging them you will only achieve making the problem worse.

You think you're unquestionably holding the moral high ground by repeatedly poking at the (Ubuntu) "haters", but I look at your language and it's kinda provocative too.

You made your point ages ago so maybe it's time to let go and if something truly requires factual addressing then stick to the facts, sans quoted "hate words"?

And it was Mark who set the tone with his unhappiness with sections of the larger Linux community. As I read his post I already knew there would some back-venting too.

Now let's just chill ok?

[duby229]

I just told you... Make a post that rebuts the other post. Then compare the likes both posts receive. It's not rocket science.

And no, insulting someone without giving any basis in facts is not "half of the truth".

So let me get this right, it's OK to like someones post, it's not ok to dislike someones post. And it's insulting when One person corrects another person for being wrong?

I can't possibly disagree with you any harder. You are so very wrong. I'm not sorry if you consider that an insult, it's not.

[Akiva]

they have wasted more than a decade pursuing a failure while they could improve linux operating systems by KDE and wayland or gnome + wayland, so to concur to spread disaffection of many users without the ability to get any market aims if not to reduce the popularity of linux operating systems. An excellent result.



as far as me fuck MIR and unity. To be exclusive for what? the failure!? A pletora of operating systems only to exalt their own EGO without the ability to take advantage of cooperation. People have to learn to compete with themselves so to make the better in sharing their abilities instead of using them to counteract.

Here is how I see it.

Myself:
- Software Developer
- Use Ubuntu, Ubuntu SDK, and Ubuntu Phone
- Contributor to Ubuntu Projects
- Worked with Canonical Developers
- Rely on Unity for development because the HUD streamlines application development, and will recommend it due to my experience.
- To New Users: Ubuntu is great to start on. Try KDE later if you like to customize, or MATE for something more straightforward.

My Unemployed Autistic cousin:
- Sys-Admin / Gamer
- Only uses Linux on his servers. Otherwise he uses windows
- Banned from a ton of Freenode channels
- Within the last year, has logged about 4000+ hours in Left4Dead
- To New Users: UNITY IS SHIT, UBUNTU IS GARBAGE, CANONICAL IS AN EVIL COMPANY, and MARK SHUTTLEWORTH IS AN EGO TRIPPING HITLER!
- Will install for new users CentOS running gnome 2.0.

- Sounds exactly like you

All you haters are my unemployed autistic cousins, who have no business lecturing other people about cooperation, or technical decisions.

[TheBlackCat]

Is KDE's mobile Plasma meant to provide convergence in the sense that you dock your phone and it dynamically adapts to the new setup, or is it just two independent builds, one for mobile and one for desktop?

Plasma is meant to switch its interface at runtime depending on the devices connected. So you connect a keyboard and mouse to your tablet and it changes to a laptop interface. You connect a TV and it changes to the media center interface. This has been the plan since long before Canonical or Microsoft tried something similar.

[timtas]

Regardless of any details in Marks post, he sadly is spot on about the currently highly aggressive climate in the "OSS community". There always used to be some "vi vs emacs" or "gnu vs bsd" fights, but people seemed to respect each other inside the OSS world. Now it's all hate, insults and deeply hurtful remarks if you happen to be on the wrong side of Redhat/Ubuntu, Wayland/Mir, Pulseaudio/Alsa, Systemd/Whatever. Money changes everything.

And Redhat indeed is highly pathetic in their approach regarding outside contribution. If people don't send patches, they are bashed for not doing so, and if they do, they are flatly ignored and told they have no clue. As countless rejected gtk/gnome contributors had to learn.

[GreatEmerald]

So let me get this right, it's OK to like someones post, it's not ok to dislike someones post. And it's insulting when One person corrects another person for being wrong?

I can't possibly disagree with you any harder. You are so very wrong. I'm not sorry if you consider that an insult, it's not.

No no, that's not what I said. When you like a post, you express that you have the same opinion. This is to prevent the need of making "+1" posts that are not very useful, and to make nice statistics. There's no need for someone to justify what they like in a post (unless they like only a part of it), because they just have the same opinion. But when you "dislike" a post, it means that you have a different opinion. But what is that opinion and why is it different? Two people can "dislike" something for completely different reasons. Hence, you need to make a post explaining why you disagree, and then look at the likes on your post to see how many people agree with your differing opinion rather than the one you're arguing against.

And I never said anything about correcting being insulting, I don't know where you get that from. Though it is insulting when someone corrects another person while using insults; but that's by definition.

[Harsh]

I stopped using Linux distros many years ago now. Mainly because... aint nobody got time for this bulls***. I dont care whose side youre on, I dont care whose right. Aint, nobody, got, time. Period.

[bregma]

Yes, it is dead. Note that it does not imply everyone stops using it right now; but any driving force is gone, it was far from finished, anyone relying on it for future development would be stupid.

If by "dead" you mean development is being continued, new versions will continue to ship, and people will continue to use it and rely on it every day, then I agree with you.