Ubuntu 14.04 Codename Revealed, Mir Haters Attacked

[Kivada]

What happens when you like both Mir and the fundamentals of the Tea Party? The Tea Party is supposed to be about promoting libertarianism - freedom of choice without burden from those that want to tax you for the inabilities of others, whilst still holding the charitable outcomes.

I think the problem is there is only so much to go around, and people have got defensive on their projects when Canonical stepped out and proclaimed the virtues of Mir project, like Wayland team. They probably said to themselves, hey why not help us rather than start a new project...

Libertarianism isn't about freedom of choice, it's about freedom to get screwed and have no recourse, hence why it was created by a group of bankers in the 1950's.

And if you want to bring Ayn Rand into it, remember, her idol was the child murderer William Edward Hickman, whom she referred to as "Superman" due to his complete lack of empathy and based John Galt on him.

[mrugiero]

He probably works form M$. M$ knows the only thing that can "break" Linux is its fragmentation. I'm sure they spend a lot of money trying to kill Linux. They want us to use the CIA/NSA supported M$ Windows 8.1.

That's paranoid. I don't think they care about the unsuccessful desktop Linux anymore, since they don't target the desktop as their primary platform anymore, as Metro shows. If they want to break something, that's Android.

Wow... has Canonical really sunk this low? Mark is accusing others of the NIH Syndrome when in fact Mir is the result of NIH (Wayland was released/worked on earlier than Mir, http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/551).

Nope, Mark is just going to the common place of pointing out someone else also did wrong to make people think it's better that way. Also, he did attack only the companies (I don't know if it's right, but it's understandable to think developers paid by a company are actually representing such company, which is what he's doing) who pointed out the flaws on Mir, not everyone else (anyway, he is lying every time he says it's "only on political ground").

It depends on how much you trust the entity which requires CLA's, personally I don't really trust Canonical not to turn around and use their sole copyright to allow proprietary extensions to Mir or something similar, I do however feel very confident that a organisation like FSF won't do anything like that as they have been unwavering in their positions regarding free software for ages, which of course is also why they exist to begin with.

The fact Canonical doesn't asks for copyright, but for the right to sublicense, should make it clear what the intention is.

[misGnomer]

Tahdy-da

If I recall correctly, Canonical's code names have quickly settled on a single word...

For this 14.04 release I suggest that single identifying nomer to be Tardy!


See: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tardy


Nothing about the quarrelling lunatic fringes here, sorry...

[shmerl]

Mir is really important work. When lots of competitors attack a project on purely political grounds, you have to wonder what THEIR agenda is.

I think the whole background of discussion about Mir misses an important point. Canonical seems to be in financial trouble now: http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/...nonical-ubuntu
Their whole rush and erratic behavior with Mir rollout and disregarding the global community can stem from the interest to monetize something fast. And they placed the bet on mobile. While using Wayland would be a good thing to do, that required more communication from them, and they decided to make things in fast half cooked way to have full control over the process and to avoid communication overhead. Whether that would bring them to the goal faster, remains to be seen. But at least it explains why they didn't care about creating this huge mess with Mir.

[kaprikawn]

...Every app developer will consume Mir through their toolkit...

Exactly which toolkits are/will be compatible with Mir?

[Hamish Wilson]

From the Wired article:

while Ubuntu itself is open source, Canonical doesn't make the source code for all of its software freely available.

Well, that answers one of the questions in this thread.

[johnc]

lol @ Canonical

[tjac]

As always Mark S. is handling the PR superbly... NOT!

Can someone please explain to me what is so bad about MIR. I've looked at it and it looks like a nice improvement. I don't know why everyone bashes it. I'm not trying to defend it, I'm just looking to get educated about what the problem with it is. I mean, there isn't anything else to use righT? There's Weston but that's just a reference thing and not even fully operational display server.

Wayland is a protocol. Why is it bad to have MIR display server based on the protocol. Thanks.

[shmerl]

Can someone please explain to me what is so bad about MIR. I've looked at it and it looks like a nice improvement. I don't know why everyone bashes it. I'm not trying to defend it, I'm just looking to get educated about what the problem with it is. I mean, there isn't anything else to use righT? There's Weston but that's just a reference thing and not even fully operational display server.

Wayland is a protocol. Why is it bad to have MIR display server based on the protocol. Thanks.

The main problem with Mir is duplication of effort and more burden on UI toolkits and drivers developers in supporting yet another display server. When everyone was planning on shifting from X.org to Wayland, came along Canonical and dropped Mir on their heads. The reason? Just for the sake of it, not really any valid technical reasons. So you can easily understand why people feel upset by this diversion.

[mrugiero]

Can someone please explain to me what is so bad about MIR. I've looked at it and it looks like a nice improvement. I don't know why everyone bashes it. I'm not trying to defend it, I'm just looking to get educated about what the problem with it is. I mean, there isn't anything else to use righT? There's Weston but that's just a reference thing and not even fully operational display server.

Wayland is a protocol. Why is it bad to have MIR display server based on the protocol. Thanks.

The problem is MIR is intentionally incompatible with the Wayland protocol, duplicating efforts both on the display infrastructure side and in the toolkit and driver implementation side. In the drivers, while it's remain to be seen, it might not be as much a problem. There are other, real world compositors, aside of Weston. One of them is GNOME-Shell, there is also KWin, I believe, then E18 and E19, and I think that's all there are currently. I believe nobody would oppose to MIR if it'd work as a Wayland compositor, instead as their own incompatible thing.

EDIT: Well, actually, there will always be haters and fanboys, and those would probably whine even if it were a Wayland compositor instead of something incompatible with everyone else. But the point is there are actual arguments to be worried.