GCC Adopts A Code of Conduct

[skeevy420]

the heck are you talking about.

My stupid jokes aside, the GCC CoC stipulates that they're accepting of anyone regardless of any reasons like color, gender, orientation, etc. Outreachy, however, specifically filters people based on those reasons. Because of that, those two CoCs and agendas conflict with one another. Since they conflict on who they accept and who is acceptable, does that mean that the GCC, or businesses/sponsors/etc, will no longer accept Outreachy applicants due to Outreachy being a racist, discriminatory, organization?

Sadly that's not enough in reality as people generally don't agree on what it means to be an asshole.

The Unfortunate Truth

[Anux]

To everyone who complains about the Code of Conduct, all I can say is, what really matters is not the CoC itself but how you use it.

In that case, why does it need a coc if we can just use it how we see fit?
If the coc allows you to use it in different ways, then it is not formulated correctly and doesn't help anyone because it means it's not clearly defined which leads to arbitrariness.

that's bullshit and you know it. CoC won't disallow telling others they screwed up. It's only disallows to be a dick about it.

Have you been sleeping the last 10 years? It will not be the first time that a coc is used for a pollitical agenda and I never have seen much use outside of such shit.
Remeber Debian starting to tell other projects how they should name their project?

Shouldn't it be the goal to have the best programmers and make GCC the best compiler? Or is it more important to not offend anyone and have political correct programmers and maybe be somewhat usefull for compiling?

If we were reading of constant harsh fights and racism in the GCC community I could atleast understand it. But according to them selfes this is a super rare occasion. The more rules we have the more can be missused.

[Venemo]

In that case, why does it need a coc if we can just use it how we see fit?
If the coc allows you to use it in different ways, then it is not formulated correctly and doesn't help anyone because it means it's not clearly defined which leads to arbitrariness.

I am sorry you didn't get the joke.

[karolherbst]

...
Outreachy, however, specifically filters people based on those reasons. Because of that, those two CoCs and agendas conflict with one another. Since they conflict on who they accept and who is acceptable, does that mean that the GCC, or businesses/sponsors/etc, will no longer accept Outreachy applicants due to Outreachy being a racist, discriminatory, organization?

The point of "Outreachy" is to bring certain topics to a group of people who are underrepresented in the field. Some of the underrepresentation might also be a cause of repression of certain groups in the past or societies having implemented inherently racist policies to marginalize such groups and we still have those things around even today. "Outreachy"'s goal is to make up for that. If you think that's racist then I can't help you as it obviously isn't.

So yes, of course it's not targeted at people from groups being over represented already.

[karolherbst]

Have you been sleeping the last 10 years? It will not be the first time that a coc is used for a pollitical agenda and I never have seen much use outside of such shit.

I'm sure you can show to one example where a relevant project abused the CoC to remove people from the project and where it wasn't either corrected or discussed afterwards once people generally agreed it was unfair.

[DanL]

Since we're living on Earth, does that mean they won't accept Outreachy interns

We're talking about a simple CoC and you immediately bring up Outreachy? You may have just been triggered..

I'm not sure why this is even news.

It's not. But if Michael gets some clickbait ad revenue from it, then I'm not opposed to it. And clearly, there are some Phoronix users that have issues with CoC's of any kind, so it gives them a chance to vent/discuss, even if we've been down this road many times before.

[DanL]

Shouldn't it be the goal to have the best programmers and make GCC the best compiler? Or is it more important to not offend anyone and have political correct programmers and maybe be somewhat useful for compiling?

False dilemma. You're asserting that accepting offensive, asshole behavior will lead to a better compiler.

[uid313]

Code of conducts are like terms of service, privacy policy, cookie consent things, end-user license agreements (EULA), etc, I don't read them.

I am fine with things like "assume good faith", but all this gender pronounce shit is too much.

[Duve]

Why is this necessary? Common sense is a thing...

Because the project does need a sign not to tap.

[skeevy420]

The point of "Outreachy" is to bring certain topics to a group of people who are underrepresented in the field. Some of the underrepresentation might also be a cause of repression of certain groups in the past or societies having implemented inherently racist policies to marginalize such groups and we still have those things around even today. "Outreachy"'s goal is to make up for that. If you think that's racist then I can't help you as it obviously isn't.

So yes, of course it's not targeted at people from groups being over represented already.

It's really messed up how conflicted I am about Outreachy. I literally know how it feels to be ostracized and outcast so I genuinely understand the good they're trying to achieve. At the same time, however, they're the same kinds of folks that'll toss me aside because they assume that all white people are the same and have the same advantages and privileges in life. Instead of looking at the person, at their life, at their difficulties and struggles, all they care about is if someone is the right kind of different. To me, that doesn't seem like outreach so I don't agree with them.

Doing the same thing to others that those you dislike did to you is hypocrisy and revenge. No matter how pretty you wrap it, that's hate and fascism. I'd respect them a lot more if they'd take the time to consider everyone while having a bias for the underrepresented. That's Equity.