systemd In 2023 Added Windows-Inspired "Blue Screen Of Death" & macOS-Inspired T.D.M.

[kiffmet]

and still didn't fix the fundamentally broken behavior of resolved

I never bothered with systemd-resolved, masked the service and always had networkmanager handle such stuff. It just werks ™

[luno]

it's not about worshiping software at a given version and say it was at its best and try to stick with that through the years even if it become horribly outdated. that would be completely wrong.

the big thing about unix/linux is the philosophy behind it: "make small tools, that do one thing only and that do it well, and allow all those small software to interact with each other" and also: "allow the user to choose which software he want to use for given tasks".

and that is where systemd fails (at that philosophy standard, that idea behind unixes and linux): it doesn't play well with the rest of software, it cannot be easily replaced with another choice, instead, it becomes an all emcompassing mandatory tool that cannot be avoided, it want to handle way too many tasks, it became a giant blob subverting/replacing all subsystems one by one. it's a plague. it kills what makes linux what it is (or was). it kills the choice, it grows out of its boundaries, it is not a simple init daemon anymore, it goes against gnu/linux core philosophy. that's what's bad about it.

is there any software which follows unix philosophy properly ?

[Shiba]

Nobody uses it.

So are you using it?

[nsklaus]

is there any software which follows unix philosophy properly ?

examples are legions. if you know your system you should understand this. all unixes are themselves the result of that philosophy. so yes OSes, for one thing.

but let's look at a smaller scale, tools that constitute them:
ls, grep, awk, sed, cp, rm, cat, package managers, and many more are all example of a tool dedicated to a specific use.

now let's look at bigger scale:
take big software like gimp, krita, audacity, dolphin (file manager) , emulators (say snes9x for example, even tools like wine.
what would you think if gimp started to handle, edit and modify audio files?
or if a file manager like dolphin would start to emulate super nintendo hardware and allow playing snes roms ?
or again if audacity would start implementing stuff to make you able to edit text documents like an office software does (edit pdf, odf, rtf, txt files).
wouldn't you agree that would be bad directions for these software ? growing past their mission, and that segmentation into multiple, dedicated, software would be better ?

systemd was initialy an init daemon. now it handle many things, like logs, system services (daemons) management and also memory usage and many more other things. they are all building upon one another requiring the entire systemd chain, you cannot replace one of its part and substitute with another software you'd prefer that implement similar functionality (like another log or service management for example). systemd becomes a tentacular dependency chain, touching many aspect of the OS. it introduce very bad (alien, miscrosoft-like, anti-unix) concept at the core of linux.

[fong38]

take big software like gimp, krita, audacity, dolphin (file manager) , emulators (say snes9x for example, even tools like wine.
what would you think if gimp started to handle, edit and modify audio files?
or if a file manager like dolphin would start to emulate super nintendo hardware and allow playing snes roms ?
or again if audacity would start implementing stuff to make you able to edit text documents like an office software does (edit pdf, odf, rtf, txt files).
wouldn't you agree that would be bad directions for these software ? growing past their mission, and that segmentation into multiple, dedicated, software would be better ?

Those tools do far more than just one thing. If they followed the unix philosophy properly each feature inside those applications would be its own separate tool - importing, editing, previewing, exporting, etc. If you widen the meaning of "do one thing" to that extent you could just as easily claim the one and only thing systemd does is system management.

[creative]

Linux stands on its own now and leads the Unix world. Unix philosophy does not need to be a firm commitment. The other unices usually take the new developments from Linux now. I prefer systemd over systemv which I used many years with Slackware. Especially, I prefer systemd handling the dependencies, instead of leaving to the admin's experience as in systemv.

Linux Is Not UniX

Nether are the BSD's.

What the GNU Linux's and the BSD's are, are Unix like operating systems. Of these some are more like Unix than others, Unix is really kind of dead in it's traditional sense.

I went back to Slackware, I used distributions using systemd from 2011 until some time in 2023 about seven months ago I think? I got tired of systemd personally.

Modern Slackware is one damn fine operating system. I run both stable and current on the same system. In fact I like it so much I donate both to the project and it's originator. Never did that with systemd based distributions, that says something.

[mrg666]

Nether are the BSD's.

What the GNU Linux's and the BSD's are, are Unix like operating systems. Of these some are more like Unix than others, Unix is really kind of dead in it's traditional sense.

I went back to Slackware, I used distributions using systemd from 2011 until some time in 2023 about seven months ago I think? I got tired of systemd personally.

Modern Slackware is one damn fine operating system. I run both stable and current on the same system. In fact I like it so much I donate both to the project and it's originator. Never did that with systemd based distributions, that says something.

I agree that Slackware is a very good OS. But I would prefer it for servers. I got bored with its conservatism for desktop where I want to try new developments. Patrick truly deserves your support. Good for you.

[creative]

mrg666 Where there is a will there is a way, for a number of people they may get irritated getting some things up and going on it. Area's that I felt needed to be filled I use flatpaks for. All the rest of it is well in place for my wants and needs.

I have come across posts on reddit with people mentioning running the same install of current anywhere from five to eight years straight on desktop.

It's interesting how your experience is the inverse of mine, I actually see a lot of it. People eventually just want something different.