Linux Mint Finds Many Of Its Users Are Running Behind On Security Updates

[ThoreauHD]

The could do a beginner install option that uses ksplice/live kernel updates ala ubuntu/redhat/oracle, and automatic security updates. Not sure where the are with live kernel patching atm though. Just plug it in and it's a kiosk for beginners.

[creoflux]

Not talking specifically about the Mint crew, but a lot of oss developers seem surprised to discover that, when they hit popularity, they suddenly have to deal with most of the problems that afflict the established (proprietary/evil/so-yesterday/etc...) players.

Users not wanting to upgrade.
Users complaining that the app is not cool and sleek and modern enough.
Users ranting that the GUI has been changed without their consent.
Users asking for more features.
Users asking for speed.
Users asking for compatibility with obscure, obsolete hardware.
Users asking for bloat reduction.
Users asking for more documentation.
Users complaining that the documentation is hard to find.
Users complaining that the doc is too detailed and verbose, and skipping it.
Having to maintain backwards compatibility with horrible design choices made when starting.

Maybe the best way to avoid all of these issues is to remain tucked away in a little, obscure niche :-D

Either that, or deploy a reality distortion field that turns all users in grateful zombies...

Damned if you do, damned if you don't!

Agreed. Also, I never understood why recruiting from people already unhappy with their OS was a good strategy. A lot of the UI choices in Desktop Linux are taken from other OSes.

[Sonadow]

The reason is simple: users don't trust Linux updates and it's not without a reason (new Linux packages often come with drastic UI changes, regressions and new bugs). The only distro with which I've had zero regressions while updating is RHEL/CentOS.

Ditto. I don't apply any updates on my Debian machines since day one. Any distribution can promise all they want, but when desktop Linux doesn't draw any distinctions between 'system' and 'user application' and treats them all as one homogeneous clump, there's no justifying the possible risk of a update to GTK3 or Qt5 suddenly breaking the entire GUI or a bunch of applications that see daily use.

Windows NT 4.0 if properly firewalled/isolated still runs seamlessly and allows to use the Internet. Why would any modern OS suddenly break if it's past EOL? I see zero reasons for that. Granted old OSes lack support for modern encryption protocols, i.e. TLS 1.2/1.3 but other than that there's nothing in them which is deteorating with time.

The operating system won't break, but they also become incompatible with certain user applications. Chrome and Firefox are not available for NT4, are you sure you want to use that ancient version of Internet Explorer to go online?

Also, it's really unwise to depend on a firewall as the line of defense from old and vulnerable applications or system files/libraries. Not that I have much room to talk with my never-updated Debian.

[skeevy420]

Agreed. Also, I never understood why recruiting from people already unhappy with their OS was a good strategy. A lot of the UI choices in Desktop Linux are taken from other OSes.

Seriously. Because this is totally appealing to a gamer:

Upset with Windows? Here's something that looks sort of like it with half of the functionality. To potentially regain most of the lost functionality you may or may not get lucky with one of our many compact layers, emulators, or virtual machines. If you have an AMD based GPU you also have multiple drivers and Vulkan implementations to test on top of all that. Have fun.

[skeevy420]

birdie Since we've all probably been hit by a bad update at some point in time that makes a lot of sense.

Then again I know some people still using Windows 7 with an ancient Chrome nagging about its lack of support because that's their new computer and it shouldn't need updates yet. That's not how it works....about a year ago they bought a refurbished eBay with 7 and that's that....Yeah, I know.

I wonder how many Mint installs are on systems like that. People given it because the installer knew the user was stupid since unupdated Mint is probably safer than unupdated Windows.

[Sonadow]

Seriously. Because this is totally appealing to a gamer:

Upset with Windows? Here's something that looks sort of like it with half of the functionality. To potentially regain most of the lost functionality you may or may not get lucky with one of our many compact layers, emulators, or virtual machines. If you have an AMD based GPU you also have multiple drivers and Vulkan implementations to test on top of all that. Have fun.

Half? Try 'none'.

Can't just simply download the game EXE or installer from the vendor's site.
Oh, the executable can't launch? Must be a bunch of missing dependencies, please search for them by trying to understand cryptic errors.
Your distribution built Mesa without a certain flag / bundled Mesa is too old? Please rebuild a new Mesa.
Our game update broke compatibility with your distribution? Sorry, but it never happens in Windows.

[birdie]

Seriously. Because this is totally appealing to a gamer:

Upset with Windows? Here's something that looks sort of like it with half of the functionality. To potentially regain most of the lost functionality you may or may not get lucky with one of our many compact layers, emulators, or virtual machines. If you have an AMD based GPU you also have multiple drivers and Vulkan implementations to test on top of all that. Have fun.

Brilliant, just brilliant. I've just LOL'ed, really LOL'ed.

[duby229]

It's the same thing that happens every single release of every single so called "stable" distro. Absolutely all of us could have predicted this... It happens to -all- of them -every- time....

[skeevy420]

Half? Try 'none'.

Can't just simply download the game EXE or installer from the vendor's site.
Oh, the executable can't launch? Must be a bunch of missing dependencies, please search for them by trying to understand cryptic errors.
Your distribution built Mesa without a certain flag / bundled Mesa is too old? Please rebuild a new Mesa.
Our game update broke compatibility with your distribution? Sorry, but it never happens in Windows.

On the half I meant music, movies, a calculator, Chrome, Firefox, etc. After basic stuff like that all bets are off.

Conversely, there's the dreaded you're using Arch, Gentoo, Fedora and your library, executable, etc is too new so Steam Game doesn't work.

[birdie]

The operating system won't break, but they also become incompatible with certain user applications. Chrome and Firefox are not available for NT4, are you sure you want to use that ancient version of Internet Explorer to go online?

Also, it's really unwise to depend on a firewall as the line of defense from old and vulnerable applications or system files/libraries. Not that I have much room to talk with my never-updated Debian.

IE with JS/ActiveX turned off is quite secure Too bad with NT 4.0 you will not be able to browse any modern HTTPS websites :-D Also, telnet still works though browsing the modern web with is simply impossible.

Probably you could compile elinks and link it with openssl statically and at least be able to browse some web sites not heavy on JS, graphics and not using downloadable fonts for navigation elements (whoever came up with this idea should not have been born) e.g. wikipedia.org