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Linux Mint Finds Many Of Its Users Are Running Behind On Security Updates

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  • #51
    I didn't read every comments yet but I'm surprised with the first ones I read. The biggest LOL was "Mint 17 is the last version without systemd they didn't want it".
    The main reason listed "They were updating but an update broke something and now they don't" is also not the real main one in my opinion.
    My parents are running Mint and they don't update the computer simply because they forget. The shield next the the hour in the bottom right is turning from green to blue when there are updates, and that's it. They don't see it, they don't update. A prompt telling "there are new updates do you want to install them?" would solve many non-upgrading users IMO.
    Then comes the "Major upgrade" of Mint, which are so painful comparing to Ubuntu and can't be done by a non-tech user.
    And then, simply, the computers which work. Windows is so bad as getting old that people buy new computers. But Linux is very strong. My grand mother is running Ubuntu 16.04 on a twelve years old laptop. I know 16.04 is getting end of life in 2 months. But will 20.04 be as performant on that old computer? Also, she's used to Unity. That means I will have to re-install it and lightdm after the upgrade. And it won't work exactly like 16.04 and she will be lost. Should I still do the upgrade? Damn, she's 83yo now, maybe she will even die before the computer (I hope not, I love her so much).
    This has nothing to do with systemd, or broken updates honestly.

    TL;DR: Warn the users about updates, make them easier to install, don't change what doesn't need to be changed and keep the perf and hardware support... That are the hard things to do to see users updating.


    • #52
      Just a reminder that Mint had a fine update mechanism for noobs but was attacked for it and had to change it.


      • #53
        Originally posted by birdie View Post
        " but this whole website is dedicated to Linux as a desktop OS which is suitable for the average Joe ..."
        Sorry for going off topic, but honest to dog what you wrote above reminded me of the another Phoronix headline I Just saw:

        The State Of ROCm For HPC In Early 2021 With CUDA Porting Via HIP, Rewriting With OpenMP

        Hey Jane and Joe Average...


        • #54
          Originally posted by skeevy420 View Post

          Seriously. Because this is totally appealing to a gamer:

          Upset with Windows? Here's something that looks sort of like it with half of the functionality. To potentially regain most of the lost functionality you may or may not get lucky with one of our many compact layers, emulators, or virtual machines. If you have an AMD based GPU you also have multiple drivers and Vulkan implementations to test on top of all that. Have fun.
          You also have to deal with random bugs in the AMDGPU driver, like screen blank after suspend and resume (recurring theme) and other nonsense.


          • #55
            Originally posted by birdie View Post

            Usually updates are bundled together as one. If I were a distro builder I'd force install security updates and even distro updates automatically (which you can opt out of) just like Windows does. Too many users are too dumb to trust them with updates. Android/Windows/iOS/MacOS all perform system updates near perfectly nowadays. Linux? I don't think it's even possible, e.g. I delayed an update from F32 to F32 for half a year (!!) because the latter didn't have an app available in the former due to broken dependencies (python and its intricate web of interdependencies).

            Again it all boils down to the fact that Linux (distros) does not have a notion of base system which is safe to update except RHEL which is not a good distro for modern PCs/laptops.
            Well in the situation you're talking about flatpak/snaps should have been used for that application and many others. On all of those other OS, apps bundle all of their dependencies (libraries, apps etc.) and each runs independent of the other.

            It's been possible on Linux for decades even before Flatpak/Snaps - with simple compressed archive files (i.e .tar.gz , .zip etc.) , same as every other OS.


            • #56
              Originally posted by Duff~ View Post
              I still remember somebody saying Linux Mint 12 was the best release, therefore he was going to use it forever.
              Some people logic is that way I guess.
              Person I know: "My friend says Ubuntu 12.04 LTS is the best, so let me install that on my desktop with Coffelake and a Polaris GPU"


              • #57
                Originally posted by spoyalloy View Post
                Michael, as a beginner & exile from MS, I too avoid updates if I can. Simply, if an update were to break my installation I would be stuffed, If I followed info in the Linux forums I would have to 'tar my ssh with... whatever '. Useless to a beginner. I keep my browser & email profiles on a separate disk and would simply reinstall the OS if it broke following a dodgy update. To miminise that faff I avoid updates.
                Mint is fine for a simple, single installation for a beginner and I found (then) that it worked OOTB, but almost all Linux is hair-tearing once the little guy tries to network at home. There is no upto date, reliable reference source for straightforward instruction as a starting point. Instead there are some 30- 40 websites all giving different instructions. Yes, of course, the 'community' will help when you are stuck, but after wading through those 30-40 sites your installation is totally borked & there is no easy starting point to offer a user good advice.
                Oddly, OpenSuse used to offer a really good GUI for setup (do they still?). But again their updates (& updates engine) would too-often foul a system causing a reinstall.
                I know folks at Linux like their terminal but, like in exams, a multi-choice question (much as in a GUI) offers a limited choice of options and is less of a typing test.
                Stay well.
                All software is buggy and broken to some extent, it's just a question of to what extent.

                I haven't been able to use my Bluetooth earphones on Windows for a few months, due to some Windows bug. Can't connect, can't unpair. All of the search results have been useless. Deleting registry keys has been useless as well (and I wasn't able to delete some keys due to unknown errors). All I can do is stare dumbly at the screen like an idiot, and hope that some great individual at Microsoft will humble themselves and deign to fix the bug that plagues me.


                • #58
                  As much as I dont like MS forcing updates....
                  it's funny MS has moved to rolling release with forced update.. which is worse running a patched windows box or 2 year old linux box... I dunno what the right answer is


                  • #59
                    Originally posted by cytomax55 View Post
                    As much as I dont like MS forcing updates....
                    it's funny MS has moved to rolling release with forced update.. which is worse running a patched windows box or 2 year old linux box... I dunno what the right answer is
                    There are many levels of complexity. To the update problem. Like people may only want updates over particular internet connections as well due to costs.