Chromium Now Supports GPU Sandboxing With Radeon Graphics On Linux

[duby229]

It's just as evil to buy GPUs instead of ASICs and choose to mine Ethereum, just because there you still have some profit, and then try to shoehorn the "banks are bad, we are freedom fighters" bullshit to justify your actions.

FYI: I know cryptocurrencies. Ethereum miners are in the same "BAD" category as bank/stock market. Because you're in it for the profit, nothing more.

Bitcoin and derivatives are already fighting The Good Battle without fucking up the GPU market (as its algorithm wasn't designed to run only on GPUs), only reason to choose Ethereum or anything else is because you want profit.

Forcing GPU-only Mining is not going to change the basic fact that company-based mining will out-compete and obsolete private small-scale miners just like happened in Bitcoin. The only difference is that consumer AMD GPU hardware availability will still be total crap for a long time, or they will have to cripple their GPUs too like NVIDIA does so they can ask a far higher price for their computing cards.

Which in most scenario's I would say hellz to tha muthafuckin naw! Dawg! But in this case I totally agree with you. But there must be some hardware characteristic (besides performance) that makes these particular cards good for ethereum mining. AMD should identify that thing whatever it is and then make a new brand just for the miners. The only way I could see that not working is if the characteristic that makes it good for mining is also the same characteristic that makes it good for gaming. And I don't know that answer.

[starshipeleven]

The only way I could see that not working is if the characteristic that makes it good for mining is also the same characteristic that makes it good for gaming.

Aaand it's actually like this, there is no escape. See this post above https://www.phoronix.com/forums/foru...525#post975525

Really, one of the main reasons I'm pissed off is that the algorithm was 100% artificial. I mean that it was made by some dudes for the sake of making something hard to compute and unpractical to design an ASIC for.

Mining is not scientific research or gaming where you have some external requirements that guide you, the mining algorithm is just a gimmick to make mining hard, they could have gone in any way, like for example requiring massive amounts of NVMe storage (they would stay within the price point of a serious mining rig), and the impact of Ethereum would have been be much less bad (there are significantly more manufacturers of SSDs and it is comparatively easier than a GPU, Samsung and friends can ramp up production much more easily than GPU manufacturers).

[duby229]

you just don't get it... whatever makes general purpose hardware better will be the bottle neck programmed in the blockchain of ethereum. because they want to defend the blockchain ethereum coin against anything else what is not general purpose hardware. If a company would bring custom build hardware to market what is not general purpose hardware they will try to cripple it down by algorithm .

right now they use:
proof of work
proof of stake
proof of space
proof of bandwidth

and many more techniques to make sure general purpose hardware get the advantage against Application-specific integrated circuit...

And meanwhile etherium miners are consuming nearly 100% of GPUs.... So it seems to me that any non-miner gpu user is the one that gets screwed. All you've done is moved the screwing from a tiny minority to a vast majority. What do you think is more wrong?

[starshipeleven]

the money-Noble just buy ASICs in a scale that the result is that they have the 51% mining power to own ANYBODYs money so hey can transfer any kind of funds to any kind of walled.

And switching to only general-purpose hardware makes harder for "Money-Nobles" to buy a truckload of general-purpose computing stuff in what way? That's my point. Rich people can outbuy you anyway, why screwing up innocents (the consumers that actually needed the consumer-grade hardware) for no reason?

Because if "Money-Nobles" just buy truckloads of GPUs and outcompete you "freedom fighters" the result is the same.

This all is not "GPU" specific this all makes sure that even CPU mining if you have hardware like IBM power9 is effective.

That hardware is horribly expensive and has little market on its own.
GPUs have much higher resale value if sold used and scale up/down much better as they can be added or removed piecemeal.

[duby229]

wrong complete wrong... ethereum is designet that "Gamers" can mine ethereum coins in the free-time they do not play games. this Dual-Use will bring them the Keypoint advantage against Money-Nobles who only buy the GPU just for mining for a mining farm.

It is designed to work well on normal general purpose hardware and to make it very hard to build custom build mining hardware for it.

the ethereum community want normal Desktop users to run ethereum mining in the idle-Time of the hardware.

Which is -not- happening. Gamers can't even get the hardware reasonably right now. It has very limited availability.

[duby229]

thats not a problem of ethereum it is a problem of AMD they need to bring more GPUs ot market.
in fact Ethereum compared to bitcoin does everything in favor of "gamers" every design decision is in favor of the gamers and every "rule" in the sourcecode is in favor of the gamers.
they just need to perform dual-use means ethereum in the idle time and gaming in the other time.

Gamers can even make a lot of money with very old hardware for example a AMD 290X is very good in ethereum mining. mining farms in general can not compete against "gamers" in mining because they have to buy the hardware full price without any dual-use.

You mean that the other way around. You got it backwards. Despite ideology the fact is that's not how it worked out. The fact of the matter is that availability for gamers is very limited -BECAUSE- etherium miners have largely bought up supplies to be used in that -SINGLE- use case. That's what actually ended up happening. You can say it was -designed- to be used by gamers for mining, but that didn't actually happen. It isn't happening now and probably won't ever happen because gamers have very limited access.

[chithanh]

And meanwhile etherium miners are consuming nearly 100% of GPUs.... So it seems to me that any non-miner gpu user is the one that gets screwed. All you've done is moved the screwing from a tiny minority to a vast majority. What do you think is more wrong?

Those miners who buy the card at retail are not even a big part of the problem. Massive mining operations which receive shipments directly from the card manufacturers are. Gamers and small-scale miners are just fighting for the crumbs that are left.

[starshipeleven]

A quick note: Ethereum has yet to switch to Casper, so it is still Proof of Work. Most of my annoyance is miners, not necessarily ethereum or whatever. When Ethereum finally enables more restrictions they will switch over to another GPU-based cryptocurrency where they can still make money.

Money-Nobles have to compete with DUAL-USE consumers and Hardware if you do play games 5 hours a day and the rest of the day you do mining you have a much better cost structure because your hardware costs you 0€ 0$ because you already bought the hardware to play 5 hours a day.

Power costs.
Also profitability. Most people won't make enough money to cover the power costs by mining with a single GPU now that there are buttloads of miners with 6x GPUs that are mining since Ethereum started.

how can the ethereum community hurt your so called small-consumers if all the rules are in favor of the small-consumer ????

Because consumers need the consumer-grade hardware for other things than mining, and if miners gobble everything up there is nothing left at decent prices for consumers.

no you are wrong. money-nobles need 300% more "prove of work" hardware resources to attack the system than the defenders of the system by the "prove of stake" rules.
with prove of stake 1/3 of the hardware performance power can outperform the 2/3 of the money-noble attackers.

Ummm... Proof of stake says that accounts with higher "wealth" (in that currency) are the ones most likely chosen to mine, and it's not terribly hard to buy large amounts of coins.

for Ethereum it's more like more wealthy can make more "security deposits" then have more voting power when there is the voting phase to validate the blocks, which is similar.

in Bitcoin only prove of work rules the world and there is no "wellfare" for small miners who only do home-idle-time-Desktop mining... but in ethereum they get the prove of stake advantage.

Only if they are relatively rich in ethereum coins to begin with. Kinda defies the point.

with this mechanism 1/3 of the performance (prove of work) can defend against a attack from money-nobles because the deposit the rich people need to pay in the pool will destroy any profit for the rich. and in the end the coins go to the small-miners as community prove of stake reward.

Taking control of the system is much more valuable than the profitability of the hostile takeover action itself.

[starshipeleven]

wrong everybody who is willing to pay the "high" price get a card !!! this is a fact!

I thought higher price limits availability, as less people will upgrade with the same regularity as they did before the price spike.

and gamers can fix this "high" price for gaming card if they do ethereum mining in the idle-time they do not game.

I it does not cover power costs alone, so unless you "own power plants" it's not feasible.

[unixfan2001]

in a free market not the most expensive price count! no! instead the most cheap price count.
so your 25$ water turns into a 0$ water °!!!1111!!!1111 because in my place the cheaptest water i can get is 0$

This makes you a Liar ... you just do not care about the truth.

And i think ethereum is highly ethical because it will in the end destroy the Banks and also the Stock Markets and both the banks and the stock market are the most unethical thinks in our world.

No, you massive dickwad! Water certainly isn't $0US in Texas (or, soon, Florida).
Sure, buyers in a homogeneous market will pick the least expensive offering. Problem is, there are no homogeneous markets and disaster areas like Houston TX certainly are the least homogeneous, leading to rapacious pricing all over the place.