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  • #11
    Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
    Do make sure with the scrolling you have hardware acceleration on. But the cell to cell bit comes from the first spreadsheet program VisiCalc yes 1979.


    There is kind of a reason. Excel allows max of 32,767 characters in a cell(that limit goes back to VisiCalc). Yes LibreOffice calc does in fact allow 2 to the power of 31 chars in a cell.

    Lot of these people cannot find shift-enter so are putting a line of text per cell instead of using the 32767 to put all the text in 1 cell. Yes there is a drop down arrow and the end of the input line that turns it into a input box in Calc and excel for a reason.

    There is a reason one MS Office users use excel so much of the stuff you describe word tables are not able to do maths dependability. Yes word table can successfully do 1+1 in sum and give you 11 for no good reason at times.

    M@GOid I would hope your define of vast is not 32767+ worth of text. Lets just say Libreoffice Calc with true 1G vast text per Cell is a little system taxing(for understatement of decade) so it kind of understand why LibreOffice wanted to display only one cells worth of data at a time.

    Yes I know people ask all the time how to I put more than 32767 chars into excel calc cell. Yes the instruction they get back all the time is just split that up over cells as solution. Not hey do you think it time to create a document to go along with that and Microsoft is not increasing the limit.



    Yes Calligra sheets is a very rare exception. Most spreadsheets programs(as in over 95% of them) follow the 1979 VisiCalc model with how to handle text in cells yes this is the the no scrolling from end of one cells contents to the start of the next cells contents.

    Yes with 32767 chars to play with you should be able do a paragraph per cell. I have seen far too many that have a paragraph split over cells as well.

    These documents I receive had no reason whatsoever to be in a spreadsheet. There is no math to be done in them. And by vast I mean a full page Phoronix article done in vertical, in one cell. My guess is, either those people are too lazy to click a couple times to change the document to landscape and create a table, or they simply don't know you can do that on Word/Writer/whatever.

    Either way, the document became very messy and unprofessional. I do my part sending them well organized documents done in a text editor, but if you are in a office environment long enough, you know some people would rather die than change their computing habits.
    Last edited by M@GOid; 15 June 2023, 07:53 AM.

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    • #12
      Originally posted by Estranged1906 View Post
      Calc might be fine for a "normal person" doing basic tasks like a household budget, calorie counting or childrens' height tracker. But for "professional work" it's just not good enough to compete with Excel.
      You see this claim there is one problem.

      MS Excel and Libreoffice calc don't overlap with each other.

      A person like me who has used Calc for professional things get to love particular features.
      Comparison of two spreadsheet files that calc support is very useful. The legacy formats that libreoffice can open that MS Office will not open can also be useful.

      The one feature missing that quickly starts annoying the heck out of me with Excel when I have to use it "Keep the copy of cells (usability of copy&paste)". When I start having to massive alter document the find and replace system limitations of Excel very quickly annoy the heck out of me.

      There are paper cuts and missing features to us who use Libreoffice Calc a lot when we have to use MS Excel. There are particular tasks Libreoffice Calc is very good at in professional usage.

      Would I say that Calc can replace Excel fully the answer is no but also Excel cannot replace Calc fully.

      Estranged1906 people working in national archives commonly use Libreoffice has a hammer and every document is nail to be open/controlled with it. If I gave you archive of old spreadsheets that national archives has to deal with with your excel you would be having issues where everything was telling you that the files were broken person on Libreoffice is just opening 98% of them without issue.

      OnlyOffice does not have support for archival documents either. Libreoffice has it place in business as software to try when someone has provided a excel document that is refusing to open with excel/word... Yes Libreoffice might open the document with broken formatting but opened is better than not opened.

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      • #13
        Originally posted by Estranged1906 View Post
        As someone who lives and breathes Excel and uses it for pretty much anything ("if you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail"), Calc just has hundreds of papercuts and missing features and incompatibilities and annoyances. An absolute non-starter. OnlyOffice Spreadsheets is not any better but at least it has a nicer user interface and seems to slowly improve over time while for Calc none of my bug reports of the last few years have made any progress (I guess there's just too many bugs and feature requests out there).

        Calc might be fine for a "normal person" doing basic tasks like a household budget, calorie counting or childrens' height tracker. But for "professional work" it's just not good enough to compete with Excel.

        Hence I'm using Excel 2016 running on PlayOnLinux...
        With my recent professional experience with onlyoffice, I would recommend you using it to work with excel files. So far, I don't have anything to complain.

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        • #14
          Originally posted by mirmirmir View Post

          With my recent professional experience with onlyoffice, I would recommend you using it to work with excel files. So far, I don't have anything to complain.
          One thing I noticed the other time it can't do is using names ranges in charts:

          1. Create new file in Excel.
          2. Create one column with dates (B4:B27) and one column with values (C4:C27).
          3. Add a date in cell C1. This is supposed to be an input for the user, with the description: "only show data until: [C1]"
          4. In Excel's name manager, create two data ranges called value_range and date_range. They are defined as =OFFSET(Sheet1!$B$4,,,COUNTIF(Sheet1!$B$4:$B$27,"< ="&Sheet1!$C$1)) for the dates and =OFFSET(Sheet1!$C$4,,,COUNTIF(Sheet1!$B$4:$B$27,"< ="&Sheet1!$C$1)) for the values. In other words, value_range and date_range include all the dates and their corresponding values that are smaller or equal to the date entered by the user in C1.
          5. Create line diagram. Create new series where the data is Sheet1!values_range and the axis labels are Sheet1!date_range. Now, the user can change the end date in C1 and the chart will only show the data until the chosen end date.
          6. Save file as .xlsx​

          The diagram works in Excel, but not in OnlyOffice or Calc. In OnlyOffice or Calc, the diagram will not update. It will appear the same way Excel last displayed it but won't update when the date in C1 is changed.

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          • #15
            Originally posted by Estranged1906 View Post
            One thing I noticed the other time it can't do is using names ranges in charts:

            1. Create new file in Excel.
            2. Create one column with dates (B4:B27) and one column with values (C4:C27).
            3. Add a date in cell C1. This is supposed to be an input for the user, with the description: "only show data until: [C1]"
            4. In Excel's name manager, create two data ranges called value_range and date_range. They are defined as =OFFSET(Sheet1!$B$4,,,COUNTIF(Sheet1!$B$4:$B$27,"< ="&Sheet1!$C$1)) for the dates and =OFFSET(Sheet1!$C$4,,,COUNTIF(Sheet1!$B$4:$B$27,"< ="&Sheet1!$C$1)) for the values. In other words, value_range and date_range include all the dates and their corresponding values that are smaller or equal to the date entered by the user in C1.
            5. Create line diagram. Create new series where the data is Sheet1!values_range and the axis labels are Sheet1!date_range. Now, the user can change the end date in C1 and the chart will only show the data until the chosen end date.
            6. Save file as .xlsx​

            The diagram works in Excel, but not in OnlyOffice or Calc. In OnlyOffice or Calc, the diagram will not update. It will appear the same way Excel last displayed it but won't update when the date in C1 is changed.
            I guess you did not hit "Shift+Ctrl+F9" when using Calc after importing xlsx and you did not save into native libreoffice format and reopen. Libreoffice does not 100 percent import.

            https://help.libreoffice.org/7.5/en-...late_hard.html Yes "Shift+Ctrl+F9" is you excel alt-f9. I have had cases of imported diagrams with Libreoffice calc not being correctly hooked up to auto update until hard recalculate is done. I have also had excel important old version excel documents have the same strangeness. Trap here is hitting alt-f9 like you would with excel does basically nothing it the wrong buttons.

            As I said libreoffice calc is not exactly excel you need to know some of calc keyboard short cuts or it can be really annoying with what should be just temporary issues.

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            • #16
              Originally posted by uid313 View Post
              The word "excellent" to describe LibreOffice sounds exaggerated. Last time I tried LibreOffice (I think it was version 7.5) it was awful!
              Yeah.... having used Microsoft Office for decades now, its basically the last good product from MS. Every few days I fire up LibreOffice to take some quick notes or do something basic, but if you want something the rest of the world will be able to open and edit, while staying formatted properly, or doing serious spreadsheet work, MS Office is the only solution.

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              • #17
                Originally posted by M@GOid View Post


                These documents I receive had no reason whatsoever to be in a spreadsheet. There is no math to be done in them. And by vast I mean a full page Phoronix article done in vertical, in one cell. My guess is, either those people are too lazy to click a couple times to change the document to landscape and create a table, or they simply don't know you can do that on Word/Writer/whatever.

                Either way, the document became very messy and unprofessional. I do my part sending them well organized documents done in a text editor, but if you are in a office environment long enough, you know some people would rather die than change their computing habits.
                A very quick VBA script in Excel would allow you to dump all the text out into a text file. A more advanced script (but still likely available from a quick google search) would let you export it into a word document.

                You can probably use the scripting in LibreOffice also.. but its purely there to abuse the user and all that is evil in the universe.

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                • #18
                  Originally posted by zexelon View Post

                  Yeah.... having used Microsoft Office for decades now, its basically the last good product from MS. Every few days I fire up LibreOffice to take some quick notes or do something basic, but if you want something the rest of the world will be able to open and edit, while staying formatted properly, or doing serious spreadsheet work, MS Office is the only solution.
                  Yeah, I've used Microsoft Office and I think it is really good. I haven't used Apple's iWork, or ONLYOFFICE or any of the other alternatives, I've briefly used Google Docs though, but I would guess they're all better than LibreOffice which I found very unpleasant.

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                  • #19
                    Originally posted by Estranged1906 View Post
                    But for "professional work" it's just not good enough to compete with Excel.

                    Hence I'm using Excel 2016 running on PlayOnLinux...
                    Claims to be a spreadsheeting "professional".
                    Uses an 8-year old version of Excel which reached end of life 3 years ago.

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                    • #20
                      Originally posted by andyprough View Post

                      Claims to be a spreadsheeting "professional".
                      Uses an 8-year old version of Excel which reached end of life 3 years ago.
                      it's the latest version that works on Wine thoughever...

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