Future of my support for ATI

[Alecz]

There is something I don't get about OS drivers, ATI, nVidia, and Intel.

I just discovered that with my Intel GMA 950 I can have Video running perfectly with Compiz. I can even zoom-in on the Video. I can have the video playing on 2 sides of the cube at the same time (1/2 video in each side). All this with no screen tearing or anything like that.

So aparently Intel has the best driver (open source).

1 - Now everyone is upset Intel is making changes to DRI-2 (http://www.phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11860)

2 - Yet, everybody is excited about the new Intel chip (http://www.phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11759)

3 - If Intel can provide such a good OS driver, why can't ATI and nVidia do the same? Aren't they all bound by the same IP restrictions?

[Melcar]

Radeon also allows for "flickerless" video playback in Compiz... as long as you use gstreamer. This is true for both windowed and fullscreen videos. Games too, although you can notice a bit of corruption in non fullscreen modes. That driver is pretty much "perfect" except for extended openGL support. We just need proper support for r5xx and newer cards, which I still think should have been the main goal of radeonHD (and we all know how that turned out).

[bridgman]

You should have the same capability in radeonhd since the last acceleration update.

[energyman]

There is something I don't get about OS drivers, ATI, nVidia, and Intel.

I just discovered that with my Intel GMA 950 I can have Video running perfectly with Compiz. I can even zoom-in on the Video. I can have the video playing on 2 sides of the cube at the same time (1/2 video in each side). All this with no screen tearing or anything like that.

So aparently Intel has the best driver (open source).

1 - Now everyone is upset Intel is making changes to DRI-2 (http://www.phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11860)

2 - Yet, everybody is excited about the new Intel chip (http://www.phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11759)

3 - If Intel can provide such a good OS driver, why can't ATI and nVidia do the same? Aren't they all bound by the same IP restrictions?

there was always a rumour that one of the reasons nvidia could not open the drivers was intel ... and once upon a time there even was an open nvidia driver - which was pulled shortly after.

You should also not forget that Intel is much bigger than nvidia&amd together. More money, more people. They can risk more and get hurt less in case of an 'emergency'.

[gtrawoger]

there was always a rumour that one of the reasons nvidia could not open the drivers was intel ... and once upon a time there even was an open nvidia driver - which was pulled shortly after.

You should also not forget that Intel is much bigger than nvidia&amd together. More money, more people. They can risk more and get hurt less in case of an 'emergency'.

Don't forget too that intel's hardware when it comes to GPU's is by far simpler. It doesn't not have all the options and instruction sets that ATI or NVIDIA provide. As well, if you tried using compiz or have a multi-user setup, you'd soon see the limitations of that driver pretty quick.

[gtrawoger]

You know it's funny... as I read through this thread and read all the different opinions and takes on all of this, it reiniterated again why Linux is going to take forever to get anywhere.

It isn't a lack of smart people in the community or that people aren't somewhat dedicated to make things work in Linux.

It's the bickering. It's the disunity. And how on earth is a company like ATI (or NVIDIA for that matter) going to be able to provide a decent driver if things are changing constantly but never are completed? How much resources do they have to invest?

It seems everything on Linux is in a perpetual BETA status, half complete and just about obsolete again. I don't mind upgrades or new features, but let's get the basics done, no?

This article posted on here shows again what I am talking about:

X Devs Drop NVIDIA Auto-Config Support

These kind of articles are a dime-a-dozen on the web. I have no idea how many developers threw in the towel because of kernel developers ("the Gods") throwing all kinds of hurdles in their way, just because they don't like each other.

I am serious. That's what's happening.

Read this:
The end of the CK kernel patch set

There are plenty more, but this is the REAL reason why we as linux users suffer with crappy drivers. I know, I know... I know what you are thinking now ... "Oh, but that shouldn't stop ATI from doing what they ought to do ..."

True, but then there is this article:

X.Org 7.4 To Lose DRI2 Support

Again, the whole underworkings of the driver base is getting changed. That means ATI would have to rewrite their drivers to make it all work for the new X.Org. (remember X86Free??)

Now I don't want to be negative toward change. But for Pete's sake, can't we just get it work for now??? And I don't need 15,000 Windows Managers (Gnome, KDE, IceBox, FluxBox, The-other-box, etc...) ... I need one!

Choice is abundant in Linux, and some believe it's what defines Linux but I think it's too much! Linux isn't growing tall... it's growing wide, spreading itself too thin. Just because they can't get along, developers just think "Well, i'll just make my own!"

...

<End Of Rant>

Oh, well, who am I kidding. I guess it's all just wishful thinking.

[Extreme Coder]

You know it's funny... as I read through this thread and read all the different opinions and takes on all of this, it reiniterated again why Linux is going to take forever to get anywhere.

It isn't a lack of smart people in the community or that people aren't somewhat dedicated to make things work in Linux.

It's the bickering. It's the disunity. And how on earth is a company like ATI (or NVIDIA for that matter) going to be able to provide a decent driver if things are changing constantly but never are completed? How much resources do they have to invest?

It seems everything on Linux is in a perpetual BETA status, half complete and just about obsolete again. I don't mind upgrades or new features, but let's get the basics done, no?

This article posted on here shows again what I am talking about:

X Devs Drop NVIDIA Auto-Config Support

These kind of articles are a dime-a-dozen on the web. I have no idea how many developers threw in the towel because of kernel developers ("the Gods") throwing all kinds of hurdles in their way, just because they don't like each other.

I am serious. That's what's happening.

Read this:
The end of the CK kernel patch set

There are plenty more, but this is the REAL reason why we as linux users suffer with crappy drivers. I know, I know... I know what you are thinking now ... "Oh, but that shouldn't stop ATI from doing what they ought to do ..."

True, but then there is this article:

X.Org 7.4 To Lose DRI2 Support

Again, the whole underworkings of the driver base is getting changed. That means ATI would have to rewrite their drivers to make it all work for the new X.Org. (remember X86Free??)

Now I don't want to be negative toward change. But for Pete's sake, can't we just get it work for now??? And I don't need 15,000 Windows Managers (Gnome, KDE, IceBox, FluxBox, The-other-box, etc...) ... I need one!

Choice is abundant in Linux, and some believe it's what defines Linux but I think it's too much! Linux isn't growing tall... it's growing wide, spreading itself too thin. Just because they can't get along, developers just think "Well, i'll just make my own!"

...

<End Of Rant>

Oh, well, who am I kidding. I guess it's all just wishful thinking.

Couldn't have said it better myself..
I'm not sure I like the fact that Intel keeps changing X.Org the way they want it, it could make it harder for radeon/radeonhd, as they'd have to adapt to whatever they add.
For example, what's so great about UMA that makes it much better than EXA? Same thing with GEM, and so on.. (GEM is probably better, but why not do this after X.Org 7.4 could've been released with DRI2?)

I keep envying nVIDIA more and more, IMO, I can't blame them for replacing most of the X.Org bits with their own, as it'd suck to adapt their driver to constantly changing components that are never out of beta.
Maybe ATi should imitate nVIDIA in this?

[Melcar]

Couldn't have said it better myself..
I'm not sure I like the fact that Intel keeps changing X.Org the way they want it, it could make it harder for radeon/radeonhd, as they'd have to adapt to whatever they add.
For example, what's so great about UMA that makes it much better than EXA? Same thing with GEM, and so on.. (GEM is probably better, but why not do this after X.Org 7.4 could've been released with DRI2?)

I keep envying nVIDIA more and more, IMO, I can't blame them for replacing most of the X.Org bits with their own, as it'd suck to adapt their driver to constantly changing components that are never out of beta.
Maybe ATi should imitate nVIDIA in this?

It gives the impression that Intel is using X as their own sandbox, and everyone is letting them. At least they're sharing...

[curaga]

It gives the impression that Intel is using X as their own sandbox, and everyone is letting them. At least they're sharing...

Do we see Intel Windowing system coming

[sundown]

I like The-other-box one

Hey, I say, if Intel are such douches, then maybe we should start buying AMD processors along thier video cards as a penalty