Android Q Reaches Public Beta With Improved Privacy, Opus/AV1 Support, ANGLE On Vulkan

[Vistaus]

Somewhat unexpected for a Google device, y'know.
For applications you can't disable, you can still revoke permissions. I have Memory, then Data Usage and then Permissions

Not really. Afaik only services that run independently from the Google Play Services main application thing are the calendar and backup sync, which won't work at all if you did not provide a google account.

It's more complex. Android does not have a concept of "administrator" with full power over everything. Each thing has a permission list, even Google services aren't running as root. "root" is a basically a dirty hack, a developer mode that bypasses all permissions.

Of course the OEM does provide software updates and could decide to "remove access" whenever they want with a specific update, but even normal Linux distros could do that.

Really, the OS is not your own property just like Linux is not your own property either (GPL does not transfer ownership), you are just providing a proof that you are entitled to use it. Does not make them the owner of your system.

With most distros you need to accept some kind of license, the fact that you don't need to pay does not make it any less "permission to use". Unless you agree to the license the installer won't start.

Does that make the distro maintainers the owners of your system? no it does not.

I agree that root is a bit of a dirty hack, but sometimes it's needed for even basic functionality. For example, if you don't have a Samsung, you can't change the default font so you need root for that. They added something in the Q beta now to change the font, but you still can't select your own font. I can change the font easily on basically any desktop OS; it's core functionality there. So it should be core functionality on Android as well, but no, you need root. And there are a few other "core" things that you can only tweak after you root your phone. So yeah, dirty hack, but sometimes it's really needed.

[starshipeleven]

OK so you can't guarantee privacy

This is much less of an issue nowadays. You can easily use a whatsapp-like application that provides end-to-end encryption instead of the "phone" app.

As long as everyone you call is using that app to receive, anyway.

Is it how NSA spies calls?

That's how anyone that wants to do it spies normal calls. NSA isn't the only player in this game.

That's why they are extremely butthurt about applications implementing end-to-end encryption over TCP/IP. Actually spying that is a whole another game.

[starshipeleven]

I agree that root is a bit of a dirty hack, but sometimes it's needed for even basic functionality. For example, if you don't have a Samsung, you can't change the default font so you need root for that.

No offence, but I really don't think changing default font is "basic functionality".

[starshipeleven]

Voice as starshipeleven wrote.

Also SMS. But still, he still has a point. It's all legacy stuff that is going to disappear or be relegated to automation (especially SMS), most modern systems rely on TCP/IP/internet, so they can encrypt on their own.

[m132]

Calendar and messages? Neither of those are even a disabled toggle on the settings.

Microphone makes sense for voice translation.

That's because you're looking at the wrong package. Disable any of the permissions for Google Play Services (com.google.android.gms), restart your device and instead of the OCR you'll get a precious stack trace yelling about a "permission denial". Pretty clever technique to fool people into thinking that Google ain't abusing your phones, eh?

Also, check Google Pay out! https://i.imgur.com/ZHgdMgO.jpg

[starshipeleven]

That's because you're looking at the wrong package. Disable any of the permissions for Google Play Services (com.google.android.gms), restart your device and instead of the OCR you'll get a precious stack trace yelling about a "permission denial". Pretty clever technique to fool people into thinking that Google ain't abusing your phones, eh?

It just means that Samsung's shitty OCR application is actually just a GUI using Google Play Services OCR/Vision API to do the actual work. https://developers.google.com/vision...etting-started

That's one of the reasons why Play Services asks so much permissions. It's also a "system library" of sorts used by other apps.

Although I don't understand why removing any permission causes breakage. I disabled all permissions on Play store and also Play services in my work phone (Huawei) and all apps I installed still work fine.

[m132]

It just means that Samsung's shitty OCR application is actually just a GUI using Google Play Services OCR/Vision API to do the actual work.

Except that the app we're talking about is Google Translate, made by Google themselves, and no Samsung is involved here I guess. Even if this API is being used there, I still fail to see how is body sensors access crucial to extract the text from a still image.

That's one of the reasons why Play Services asks so much permissions. It's also a "system library" of sorts used by other apps.

The popup screenshot I've linked to in my previous post displays the actual list of permissions the requestor wants. Some Google apps just show Storage, or Phone there, and this is completely understandable. Pay explicitly demands access to everything. What's your excuse now?

[starshipeleven]

Except that the app we're talking about is Google Translate, made by Google themselves, and no Samsung is involved here I guess. Even if this API is being used there, I still fail to see how is body sensors access crucial to extract the text from a still image.

Weird, my Google Translate of realtime camera view works fine with all permissions disabled in Play Services. Can I shit-talk Samsung now? Because I really want to blame them for breaking this shit in their phone.

The popup screenshot I've linked to in my previous post displays the actual list of permissions the requestor wants. Some Google apps just show Storage, or Phone there, and this is completely understandable. Pay explicitly demands access to everything. What's your excuse now?

On my Phone it only requires Google Play Services to access to Telephone, SMS and contacts.

Telephone/SMS is usually used to identify the device through IMEI or SIM or something like that, other apps do it. Contacts is probably to send money to friends or whatever, which should not be a mandatory thing but I guess Google wants that to work?

But still, it's Google Pay. Even if it was not asking for that info it would still have payment information and your bank account or something. Anyone who remotely cares about privacy won't let Google know what they bought, when and from where anyway, so it's not terribly important.

[m132]

Weird, my Google Translate of realtime camera view works fine with all permissions disabled in Play Services. Can I shit-talk Samsung now? Because I really want to blame them for breaking this shit in their phone.

Interesing, the AR translator seems to be working for me too. The problem comes up when you disable the instant mode or try to use the "pick from gallery" button.

Telephone/SMS is usually used to identify the device through IMEI or SIM or something like that, other apps do it. Contacts is probably to send money to friends or whatever, which should not be a mandatory thing but I guess Google wants that to work?

Having access to any of these just to be able to send a few bytes over NFC is not required or even reasonable. Just like having to explicitly allow Google to store your location and activity history in order to get a damn weather forecast on the homescreen.

other apps do it

Are you okay with this?

[starshipeleven]

Interesing, the AR translator seems to be working for me too. The problem comes up when you disable the instant mode or try to use the "pick from gallery" button.

Ah ok, that's a moot point then. That functionality works by sending the picture to Google servers anyway (I also get a popup asking if I want Google to remember the pictures I send). Won't work without internet access either. So yeah, whatever, if you do that all your data will belong to Google.

The AR translator actually works offline as long as you have the offline dictionaries, and it's pretty decent as long as you are translating from "X language" to english.

Having access to any of these just to be able to send a few bytes over NFC is not required or even reasonable.

sorry what the fuck? Google Pay isn't a NFC tag reader/writer app. It's a payment processor endpoint.

It is required (and should also be a good thing) to be able to identify and authorize the device for the very least, before it can be used to pay for things.

It also runs some tampering checks through SafetyNet https://koz.io/inside-safetynet/ (which aren't terribly hard to pass if you use something like Magisk for your root and advanced functionality, which is what you should be using on your device anyway if you are a power user)

You can read the statement if you try to add a credit card to Google Pay, it tells you that it may/will give that info to the credit card provider or something.

Just like having to explicitly allow Google to store your location and activity history in order to get a damn weather forecast on the homescreen.

Yeah this is stupid, but it is hardly a unique functionality so whatever, disable it and use something less stupid.

Are you okay with this?

If the app is indeed requiring that information to identify the device to function, yes.