SDL Developers Weigh Reverting Wayland Over X11 For SDL 3.0

[s_j_newbury]

My gripe with Wayland replacing X11 is that Wayland wasn't , or isn't, a complete solution even theoretically. We're getting there, but it has taken a long, long time. Had "someone" actually planned a complete ecosystem instead of having small islands of software, we would have had a much easier transition.

This only could have happened if the decision had been made not to integrate XWayland, the major distros set an transition date and therefore force adoption. Any software not ported would have to be dropped. Maybe it would all be better now, or maybe everybody would have jumped ship to an X11 only distro to continue using xeyes?

[S.Pam]

This only could have happened if the decision had been made not to integrate XWayland, the major distros set an transition date and therefore force adoption. Any software not ported would have to be dropped. Maybe it would all be better now, or maybe everybody would have jumped ship to an X11 only distro to continue using xeyes?

I am not sure about that. A forced date would only happen if there was a serious plan and development. Having a compatibility layer surely isn't the obstacle?

[bug77]

Xorg trolls, do not celebrate yet.... Issues like this are GOOD, because they lead to the implementation of new protocols to solve them.... Eventually Wayland will be a rock solid default for SDL 3.0 . No matter how much you spread FUD and troll against Wayland, Xorg is dead. Deal with it.

At this point, I'm trying to think what Wayland does include, seeing as fixing each and every problem needs yet another protocol.

[S.Pam]

At this point, I'm trying to think what Wayland does include, seeing as fixing each and every problem needs yet another protocol.

That's the point I was trying to say in a round about way in https://www.phoronix.com/forums/foru...70#post1452470

[mxan]

Do you know when X11 will get HDR support? I mean, its out for 40 years now.

The beginnings of HDR support in X.org (a deep color protocol) was worked on back in 2017 but didn’t get developed further.

It’s pretty interesting that you ask “when will X.org get a niche feature only people with $$$$ screens can benefit from” while everyone else is asking “why is Wayland still missing so many features after 16 years of mainly corporate-funded development”?!

[-MacNuke-]

It’s pretty interesting that you ask “when will X.org get a niche feature only people with $$$$ screens can benefit from”

Well I mean... Steam Deck OLED has an HDR screen and it is a Linux machine... And it costs like 500 bucks for the entire handheld.

[Sunderland93]

My gripe with Wayland replacing X11 is that Wayland wasn't , or isn't, a complete solution even theoretically. We're getting there, but it has taken a long, long time. Had "someone" actually planned a complete ecosystem instead of having small islands of software, we would have had a much easier transition.

According to https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/X_Window_System the X11 protocol was finalised 1987, three years after initial release.
Wayland had its initial release 15 years ago, and its ecosystem is still not feature complete, comparatively.

Wayland was completely standardized and finished in 2013. And going back to Xorg - it's not just about the core protocol, but also about many extensions. The same DRI appeared many years later, not to mention other extensions.

[-MacNuke-]

According to https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/X_Window_System the X11 protocol was finalised 1987, three years after initial release.
Wayland had its initial release 15 years ago, and its ecosystem is still not feature complete, comparatively.

Well, you are comparing a system like Wayland that describes behaviors and intentions of different aspects to get more functional control over what is and should happen to a system like Xorg that is basically "I can draw line, here framebuffer".

Thats why Xorg is such a dysfunctional garbage when it comes to things not being there 40 years ago. A computer with TWO screens? Witchcraft! And everything beyond that is as broken as well.

[V1tol]

I wonder how Wayland driver for WINE workarounds that requirements because using that I noticed better frame pacing and overall smoothness in games in KDE Wayland session even compared to X11 session without compositor.

The beginnings of HDR support in X.org (a deep color protocol) was worked on back in 2017 but didn’t get developed further.

It’s pretty interesting that you ask “when will X.org get a niche feature only people with $$$$ screens can benefit from” while everyone else is asking “why is Wayland still missing so many features after 16 years of mainly corporate-funded development”?!

How things are going back in 2007? My 2K 144Hz + FreeSync + very basic HDR monitor costed me anew 400$ 2 years ago in my hole with high taxes and customs. Today almost anything is sold with at least some HDR support. I wouldn't call that niche.

[Mani]

My gripe with Wayland replacing X11 is that Wayland wasn't , or isn't, a complete solution even theoretically. We're getting there, but it has taken a long, long time. Had "someone" actually planned a complete ecosystem instead of having small islands of software, we would have had a much easier transition.

According to https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/X_Window_System the X11 protocol was finalised 1987, three years after initial release.
Wayland had its initial release 15 years ago, and its ecosystem is still not feature complete, comparatively.

I honestly don't get where this 15 (or 16) years ago comes from?
The initial idea of Wayland was conceived in 2008 but its first release was in November 2012, yes its 12 years ago, but it is certainly not 16 years