What Not To Expect From The Linux 2.6.40 Kernel

[ninez]

No, its not me, who is crashing on the the linux... the linux is what crashing those computers

Linux doesn't crash over here, at all.

Maybee becouse you not even really using them, just watching the loading desktop and enjoying the nirvana?

that's funny. - i just watch the desktop loading, ya right! try again fool.

Here's some applications that i own and use daily. Blender, Adobe CS5, CinePaint, mypaint and Gimp for artistic stuff. VMware Workstation 7 (with several networked VMs for testing infrastructure / applications for Work). Aptana Studio (IDE). Many Linux audio apps (ardour, renoise, VSTs (both native and wine, oomidi2, many others) - I compose and write Music, and also have built a hardware synthesizer / looper / effects Rack - built on Linux, that has 100% uptime, no glitches EVER and that is sooooo reliable, it's like clock-work. i have no issues ever using live with my band (3yrs running like smooth). A commercially available platform that is very similar;

http://www.museresearch.com/products/receptor.php

I also program in C++, php, among other things. Which why I was interested in looking at some of your code, being as you have already pretty much said that you are a god at programming, and that you could rewrite linux entirely by yourself.

Now i just think i win, and you lost this arguing

so i not even continue to read it

hail penguin ;P

all you are doing here is trolling, you are unwilling to back up a single claim you have made, you are a whiner and are not able to fix the most basic of problems in Linux. I highly doubt you are nearly tech-savvy as you say, you have not convinced me of anything you have said. You also seem to struggle understanding basic concepts...

If you don't like Linux, that's fine. You have choice in what software you choose to use, but consistently complaining, whining and posting in true pure troll, just makes you look ridiculous. My advice, stop being a hater, and go enjoy your Microsoft experience - from all of what you have said - it sounds like that is the OS you are looking for, right?

I myself, am quite happy with Linux. is there room for improvement and other things to still be overcome - sure. But there is also a lot of flexibility, portability and granular control not found in OSes such as MacOSX or Windows.

do i feel the need to go over to microsoft's forums and whine and complain like a little baby to users because i personally don't like certain things about Windows? nope. it's a waste of time. (especially, in your case, where you claim to be a class A programmer, but are unwilling to contribute.

cheerz

[Geri]

Dude, this is Linux. If you want a control panel, you have to write it yourself ("patches welcome".) If you don't know how, you have to learn programming in C and C++. After 2 years of work and becoming adept in coding, you submit your patch upstream. It's rejected because control panels suck (they're user friendly, so we don't want them.) You just wasted 2 years of your life. Grats.

Welcome to Linux :-)

Dude, this is real world. No one want to configure graphics cards by writing config files.
Thanks for the informations, if i now would decide to learn C and i would learn it for 2 years, i definietly would NOT submit any patch, i am sure. Thank you for warning me, i dont like to waste years!

Welcome to Real World!

[RealNC]

aggree. But once, if you have display, i think its better to adjust settings there. Its not necessary to remove textfileconfigs, they can coexist: so i suggest to create control panel, that would be far better solution.

Dude, this is Linux. If you want a control panel, you have to write it yourself ("patches welcome".) If you don't know how, you have to learn programming in C and C++. After 2 years of work and becoming adept in coding, you submit your patch upstream. It's rejected because control panels suck (they're user friendly, so we don't want them.) You just wasted 2 years of your life. Grats.

Welcome to Linux :-)

[Geri]

A control panel won't do you much good if you have no display. Command line switches allow you to make configuration changes without requiring a display. Some people like the flexibility to configure things without a GUI.

aggree. But once, if you have display, i think its better to adjust settings there. Its not necessary to remove textfileconfigs, they can coexist: so i suggest to create control panel, that would be far better solution.

[agd5f]

Yes, its good to avoid it, but communicating with drivers through boot flags with kernel mode drivers in an operating system, is the most laughable design flaw i ever heard. First, the communication itself. How about pressing a button on boot, and ban the driver on a simple graphics interface? However, this does not solve the main problem: passing parameters to DRIVERS to allow the normal operating of an operating system. Did the radeon developers even heard from control panels? They should really create one, and if somebody have an issue disables it on a nice graphics panel... This is a graphics driver after all...

Boot switches... jesus...

A control panel won't do you much good if you have no display. Command line switches allow you to make configuration changes without requiring a display. Some people like the flexibility to configure things without a GUI.

[Geri]

No, i think it is probably you who sucks at using linux.

No, its not me, who is crashing on the the linux... the linux is what crashing those computers

I've been using linux for years, and it hasn't sucked on any computer that i have set it up on. maybe the problem is you?

Maybee becouse you not even really using them, just watching the loading desktop and enjoying the nirvana?

now i just think you are full of shit.

Now i just think i win, and you lost this arguing

so i not even continue to read it

hail penguin ;P

[ninez]

Well yeah, i made a mistake, i sayd ,,i suck with it'' while actually linux sucks with the computer, even to load on some

backtracking on your words, eh? ;P No, i think it is probably you who sucks at using linux. I've been using linux for years, and it hasn't sucked on any computer that i have set it up on. maybe the problem is you?

I dont really want to answer you every points, i respect it (i also respect the oppinion of a suicide, who jumps out from the window ).

What an idiotic statement.

And no, i will not make links - i am not here, to enlarge my e-penis. The reality is that my success does NOT depends on the oppinions of the linux community. Linux community is not in a position to questioning me. My success depends only on the quality of my work, and the number of my costumers.

yup, that's what i thought. you are all talk! taking pride in the work you do, and providing a link, has nothing to do with ego - i was sincere and wanted to check out some of your work, but now i just think you are full of shit.

The success of the linux depends on the end-users. Oh and also on the developers ofc. And at the moment, linux does not have enough from both. Becouse the community, like you, think that adding a boot switch is evolving

so Linux' growth is directly correlated to boot flags? wow. how incredibly dumb of an argument. there are so many other potential issues (that could actually be a real issue), but in your mind it simply comes down to boot flags. no offense dude, but that is the absolute stupidest logic (or lack there of) that i have ever heard.

I see the, ultimate argument on bugs is: then you should use different operating system. I am sure, this will attract additional millions of new linux users

no. i guess you are not understanding something. Coming on a *nix forum and whining like a little bitch, making grand claims about your programming skills, that just seem straight up FALSE, and then blaming all of YUOR issues on boot flags, when it sounds more like you just don't have good problem solving skills, and you don't even sound very savvy at all. but since all you do is complain and hate on Linux - sure i'll tell you to go use Windows instead, why wouldn't I?!?!?

it's not like you have anything to contribute anyway - you're just here to troll.

And see? Thats alreday happend: i use windows in the 98% of my time.

Good for you. I use Linux 99% of the time. My systems aren't buggy. I actually know how to install linux and trouble-shoot issues, if and when they arise. I can do anything that i would normally use a computer for in OSX or windows, but have a much nicer experience using my Linux desktops.

but if windows works for you, and you can't get Linux to work the way you like, then Windows is a good choice, right?

myself, I would use MacOSX and Linux any day of the week over any version of Windows.

[Geri]

Well yeah, i made a mistake, i sayd ,,i suck with it'' while actually linux sucks with the computer, even to load on some

I dont really want to answer you every points, i respect it (i also respect the oppinion of a suicide, who jumps out from the window ).

And no, i will not make links - i am not here, to enlarge my e-penis. The reality is that my success does NOT depends on the oppinions of the linux community. Linux community is not in a position to questioning me. My success depends only on the quality of my work, and the number of my costumers.

The success of the linux depends on the end-users. Oh and also on the developers ofc. And at the moment, linux does not have enough from both. Becouse the community, like you, think that adding a boot switch is evolving

I see the, ultimate argument on bugs is: then you should use different operating system. I am sure, this will attract additional millions of new linux users
And see? Thats alreday happend: i use windows in the 98% of my time.

[ninez]

Thank you for your good answers, i found really entartaining to argue about this.

Yeah, that is what i using. I also have Suse, but i will switch to another distro maybee.

i didn't realize we were arguing, i thought just having a converstion.

Yes, its good to avoid it, but communicating with drivers through boot flags with kernel mode drivers in an operating system, is the most laughable design flaw i ever heard. First, the communication itself. How about pressing a button on boot, and ban the driver on a simple graphics interface? However, this does not solve the main problem: passing parameters to DRIVERS to allow the normal operating of an operating system. Did the radeon developers even heard from control panels? They should really create one, and if somebody have an issue disables it on a nice graphics panel... This is a graphics driver after all...

Boot switches... jesus...

they are common in many OSes and are handy to have. I've made good use of them in Unix, Linux and MacOSX. in a few situations, if they had not been there to exploit - i wouldn't have been able to fix a problem i was having... and a 'graphics panel' will not help you, if you cannot boot into the operating system to make the affected change required. that should be pretty obvious though...

Users does not want to configure. Or at least, not such basic things. They want to use they computers: browse the internet, use facebook, put they usb hdd in to share they pictures with friends... they not want to understand operating systems. This is one of the biggest fail in the linux conception. To satisfy the demands of the users in 2011, config textfiles is not a suitable thing.

Tell that you Gentoo, Archlinux and many other distributions/communities. I am a user and i want to configure. why? because my system ends up being better than using the insane defaults of distro's like Ubuntu, Fedora and Suse. my system also ends up being exactly what i want, and behaves the way i tell it to.. So, you can tell you beef to Ubuntu/Suse, but don't generalize and assume that all linux users want no config files, etc. because lots do - which is my point.

I opened the source codes to fix the bug... after i figured out, what causing the problem, my hands slowly started to move into the direction of the keyboard... and i just started laughing. Becouse the code was so mutch flawed, i have been never seen so bad source code in my entry life. And as a ,,bad code'' i not mean that it used some wrong structuration, or was deceived, or just bad paradigms.. no.. the whole code - so the whole disc handling was based on multiple designing flaws. After i have realised, what i see, i have seen a mutch more funny thing: there was 2-3000 hdd handcoded into some parts of the driver to avoid this design flaw. Without this, linux kernel would just simply hang with this devices. Oh, basically the whole hdd handling is broken, in every part, including every simple C file. Not that is the strange that my hdd dont work. The strange is, that linux HOW is able to boot even?!
Oh and i dont fixed the code. I just closed the code, and removed linux from the system. Becouse i dont touch such things.

if you could fix it, and didn't - than you have nothing to complain about. this just sounds like a lame excuse.

You know, like a dieing dog, you have no chanche to save it, its blood trickling out, pus flowing out from the lower parts, its mouth foams... giving out strange noises...
you dont touch things like that either :P
only if somebody pay for you for it becouse you are a flayer...
but i am not a flayer, so i will not touch this doggie, called linux
i just look at it and i say: oh my god, you poor thing, what happended to you... wait, i go for my gun *partition delete, installer disc throw to garbage*

again, why complain then? you contribute nothing, (even though you claim you could fix the problems, easily). are you just trolling? it seems like it.

I am not a prophet, i dont want to save linux from the apocalypse. I just saying my oppinions. And they are true. BTW i never sent any code to linux kernel, and i will NEVER send any. I have cooperated with some developers back then for serious linux base apps, i even helped in some source codes for them (for example in Wine). But i did not wrote my name there. You know, there is some documents you dont sign
You know, why i would only touch linux if i would recive money for it? To compensate for my psychological injuries i would recive by watching the source code, as a solatium. But this will never happend, as you can guess :P

Well, you certainly do seem to tout yourself as a 'god of coding' (which is above being a prophet) - you're too good to contribute, but not good enough to NOT complain. ~ could you provide links to some of this amazing code you write and/or commits to what you call 'serious linux base apps'. i'm having trouble taking your word for it. I also program a little bit, so it might be nice to have a look, for myself.

Yeah, they cannot be compared in some ways, but if you want to make a call, you dont need to write text configfiles at last...

true, to some degree - but you might need to program the phone numbers into your contacts for quick access, which is essentially writing them into what are no doubt text files or something of the like. In fact, by the time you have typed all the various info into your typical contact list found on most devices (ie: phone # , name, address, etc) you have long been finished editng a config file.

Depends on, what we call, ,,evolve''.
I would not call this evolve. Windows 3.1 -> win9x is an evolve. Win 9x to Windows XP is an evolve.
Linux does not evolving. They painting new and better icons, they fixing some bugs, they adding new drivers... and thats all. They just rolling the bad, old, broken structures before them, like a scarab... No really novelty. Instead, the gworth of the incohesive source code resulting more and more problems in the distributions, for example, impenetrable and unnecessary dependency networks, based on outdated and designflawed old packages.

that is simply not true. things do change, and there is far more than just bug-fixes. KMS, USB3.0 didn't exist in even early 2.6.xx and that is just 2 very small examples. Did you not just read about 'thunderbolt' coming to Linux - how is that not things moving forward? as far as dependencies and packaging. I've never had real dependency problems. ie: they are always easy to resolve, as for as impenetrable - i think YOU must be doing something wrong.... but i don't use Ubuntu or Suse, really. although i have. Something to remember as well, linux 'rolls' along, we don't have an xp, vista, then win7. i think you are expecting Linux to be Windows, and do everything the way Windows does, which is retarded.

again, Linux and *nix systems in general, aren't windows. if you prefer windows, then use windows. but stop whining like a little girl about it.

Desktop linux distributions, such as ubuntu and suse, also meant to satisty they needs. To clickclick, automatism, happyness. However, they also full of this problems. This is a bad objection i think.

Ubuntu and Suse's goals may be to be point and click happiness, but i don't always think that is the case, and i also think that inherently using nearly all *nix systems, you tend to have to do more than just point and click - which was my point in the first place! and it's not an objection - but reality. That is also why i said, if that is not the experience you are looking for, than maybe Linux isn't for you.

Yes, becouse of this reasons, linux community canot grown. For now, it would be able to gain above 60% market share, if it would be usable. But its not rellay usable for the masses. See, i am a coder, and i also suck with it: what an average user would say? Who does not even know, what is a partition. Who want just to facebook... and hear musics... ,,oh sorry but you need to type texts to config files, and oh, if you got no sound, try to write this and this text when you boot, maybee it helps''... no, (s)he will uninstall it, and will probably drop the installation cd into the garbage - where it should be placed aniway.

You're a coder, but also suck at it (using linux), and yet you say you could rewrite the whole thing? ya, right...LOL idiot. ;P I don't think Linux is ready for people who can't use a computer very well, to a degree. I think that the aim is user-friendlyness, for sure (for Ubuntu anyway), but Linux isn't just about a desktop OS that is competing with Windows, it's uses for reach beyond that. (everything from HPC, mobile industry, industrial applications, dedicated music hardware, servers, desktops, workstations, the list goes on).

At least, if you experiment what libraries should you use, you can do it. However, there is not even usable and correct documentation, how to do it - you should experiment it yourself, wich is very huge time, a developer maybee isnt interested to do like that to port his application to linux becouse of this.

i think that entirely depending on the toolkits / libs you are using. Some stuff is very well documented, while some may not be. but you do have the choice to pick what you want to use. QT for example is very well documented. You really don't sound like a very knowledgeable skilled programmer/developer. more and more this seems to be apparent. Even hte most obvious stuff seems to be escaping you

[Geri]

Thank you for your good answers, i found really entartaining to argue about this.

Use Windows then....

Yeah, that is what i using. I also have Suse, but i will switch to another distro maybee.

Agreed, stable drivers is always a good thing. But in the circumstance of a bug being present, it's really nice to be able to stop it from affecting you, with a boot flag

Yes, its good to avoid it, but communicating with drivers through boot flags with kernel mode drivers in an operating system, is the most laughable design flaw i ever heard. First, the communication itself. How about pressing a button on boot, and ban the driver on a simple graphics interface? However, this does not solve the main problem: passing parameters to DRIVERS to allow the normal operating of an operating system. Did the radeon developers even heard from control panels? They should really create one, and if somebody have an issue disables it on a nice graphics panel... This is a graphics driver after all...

Boot switches... jesus...

edit /etc/fstab and stop whining! it takes 10secs (literally!). it's reality that with the majority or *nix systems, you might be required to configure something, yourself... and depending on the distro - you might be required to do more.

Users does not want to configure. Or at least, not such basic things. They want to use they computers: browse the internet, use facebook, put they usb hdd in to share they pictures with friends... they not want to understand operating systems. This is one of the biggest fail in the linux conception. To satisfy the demands of the users in 2011, config textfiles is not a suitable thing.

About the HDD - that sucks, have you reported the bug upstream and provided a detailed bug report? you also say (later) that if someone was willing to pay you, that you could indeed re-design Linux - so what about debugging your problem and submitting your patch upstream? if you are capable of redesigning the whole OS - *you should be fully capable of fixing a problem with one driver*. - by what you say further down, this shouldn't even break a sweat, for a programmer as highly skilled as yourself!

I opened the source codes to fix the bug... after i figured out, what causing the problem, my hands slowly started to move into the direction of the keyboard... and i just started laughing. Becouse the code was so mutch flawed, i have been never seen so bad source code in my entry life. And as a ,,bad code'' i not mean that it used some wrong structuration, or was deceived, or just bad paradigms.. no.. the whole code - so the whole disc handling was based on multiple designing flaws. After i have realised, what i see, i have seen a mutch more funny thing: there was 2-3000 hdd handcoded into some parts of the driver to avoid this design flaw. Without this, linux kernel would just simply hang with this devices. Oh, basically the whole hdd handling is broken, in every part, including every simple C file. Not that is the strange that my hdd dont work. The strange is, that linux HOW is able to boot even?!
Oh and i dont fixed the code. I just closed the code, and removed linux from the system. Becouse i dont touch such things. You know, like a dieing dog, you have no chanche to save it, its blood trickling out, pus flowing out from the lower parts, its mouth foams... giving out strange noises...
you dont touch things like that either :P
only if somebody pay for you for it becouse you are a flayer...
but i am not a flayer, so i will not touch this doggie, called linux
i just look at it and i say: oh my god, you poor thing, what happended to you... wait, i go for my gun *partition delete, installer disc throw to garbage*

how much code have you already contributed to the Linux stack?? because, right now it sort of sounds as if you are all talk, and just pissed off.

I am not a prophet, i dont want to save linux from the apocalypse. I just saying my oppinions. And they are true. BTW i never sent any code to linux kernel, and i will NEVER send any. I have cooperated with some developers back then for serious linux base apps, i even helped in some source codes for them (for example in Wine). But i did not wrote my name there. You know, there is some documents you dont sign
You know, why i would only touch linux if i would recive money for it? To compensate for my psychological injuries i would recive by watching the source code, as a solatium. But this will never happend, as you can guess :P

Android is for smart phones and tablets - comparing it to a Desktop OS is a bit like comparing apples and oranges.

Yeah, they cannot be compared in some ways, but if you want to make a call, you dont need to write text configfiles at last...

Not evolving since 2001? lol. that's the funniest thing i've heard all day. Maybe you should actually go and refresh yourself on what linux was like back in 2001, have a look at many FOSS projects back in '01. Linux has matured quite a bit, there were many limitations back then, that i am not encumbered by now, way less support back in the day, nor were the applications nearly as good, etc, etc. i think you are being very overly dramatic

Depends on, what we call, ,,evolve''.
I would not call this evolve. Windows 3.1 -> win9x is an evolve. Win 9x to Windows XP is an evolve.
Linux does not evolving. They painting new and better icons, they fixing some bugs, they adding new drivers... and thats all. They just rolling the bad, old, broken structures before them, like a scarab... No really novelty. Instead, the gworth of the incohesive source code resulting more and more problems in the distributions, for example, impenetrable and unnecessary dependency networks, based on outdated and designflawed old packages.

It sounds like *nix systems aren't for you, and you should probably just move on, instead if it isn't working for you - so why complain? - there is always Windows and Mac for people who don't like the commandline, don't want to have to edit config files, who want everything done for them, want 'simple' and who want that style of OS.

Desktop linux distributions, such as ubuntu and suse, also meant to satisty they needs. To clickclick, automatism, happyness. However, they also full of this problems. This is a bad objection i think.

I am a 'user', and i don't mind configuring my OS, in fact, i like to have the granular control over it. ...and there are distributions of linux that are quite popular that hold to the idea that the user is going to be expected to be directly invloved in setting up and maintaining the system. I think your idea of 'user' does not include many users within Gnu/Linux community.

Yes, becouse of this reasons, linux community canot grown. For now, it would be able to gain above 60% market share, if it would be usable. But its not rellay usable for the masses. See, i am a coder, and i also suck with it: what an average user would say? Who does not even know, what is a partition. Who want just to facebook... and hear musics... ,,oh sorry but you need to type texts to config files, and oh, if you got no sound, try to write this and this text when you boot, maybee it helps''... no, (s)he will uninstall it, and will probably drop the installation cd into the garbage - where it should be placed aniway.

but i do agree - obviously, developers want stable APIs and Libraries, this is an area that needs to be worked on, and that can be flaky. However, as far as libraries are concerned, developers can easily package in their own libs - there are applications that do this, in situations where they want a specific version and to not have breakage do to version changes. it's not a huge deal.

At least, if you experiment what libraries should you use, you can do it. However, there is not even usable and correct documentation, how to do it - you should experiment it yourself, wich is very huge time, a developer maybee isnt interested to do like that to port his application to linux becouse of this.