Debian Now Voting On Init System Coupling

[Awesomeness]

Which basically means green light to systemd takeover of the Debian ecosystem. Because you cannot really separate the non-toxic part.

That comment is a perfect example that the poster is one of the aforementioned clowns.

[GreatEmerald]

@pal666

You do know that there is an edit button?

To be fair, the edit button is rather useless as it works only for a couple of minutes...

[Vim_User]

people are judged by their current actions. and if now they are acting as clowns, then now they are clowns.
if he is acting as raging maniac, then he is raging maniac.

Please apply that to yourself only one time.

[interested]

smart guys wouldn't advocate stupid solutions

past accomplishments do not translate into infallibility. people are judged by their current actions. and if now they are acting as clowns, then now they are clowns.
if he is acting as raging maniac, then he is raging maniac.

"past accomplishments do not translate into infallibility" is not what I said. I said smart people with a public track record of working for Linux, deserves respect, even if you and I disagree with certain opinions they have. Calling open source developers like Ian Jackson for "clowns" is just stupid derogatory name calling. It doesn't explain anything at all either, it may give you a smug satisfaction of "putting them down", but it utterly fails in explaining what Ian Jackson have done or why you disagree with that, so it just becomes negative noise.

I have probably read every email in the CTTE list the last two months, and I can tell you that each and every CTTE member deserves respect for being really smart guys.

[psychoticmeow]

"past accomplishments do not translate into infallibility" is not what I said. I said smart people with a public track record of working for Linux, deserves respect, even if you and I disagree with certain opinions they have. Calling open source developers like Ian Jackson for "clowns" is just stupid derogatory name calling. It doesn't explain anything at all either, it may give you a smug satisfaction of "putting them down", but it utterly fails in explaining what Ian Jackson have done or why you disagree with that, so it just becomes negative noise.

I have probably read every email in the CTTE list the last two months, and I can tell you that each and every CTTE member deserves respect for being really smart guys.

So we should respect Ian, and not call him out on his bad ideas just because he has been around for a while and contributed a lot? No. His outburst on the CTTE made it clear this is entirely too personal for him, and his earlier conspiracy mongering make it clear why. This guy abandoned rational thought, got emotional and had a fit when things didn't go his way.

If thats the sort of person you want in the CTTE, that's fine, but when I or anyone else calls him a clown, we're giving him the respect we think is due.

[frign]

'nuff said

Only because systemd makes use of advanced features of the Linux kernel. You would rather ignore technical advancement?

One word: PID1. Enough said.

[Gusar]

So we should respect Ian, and not call him out on his bad ideas just because he has been around for a while and contributed a lot?

Calling him out on his bad ideas would be saying something like: His ideas are unworkable because they put a big burden on maintainers in a distro whose policy is not to dictate to people what they must be working on, and because it would mean packages wouldn't be allowed to make use of new functionality that solves problems a "lowest common denominator" approach does not solve.

Calling him a clown is not calling him out on his bad ideas. It's calling him a clown.

Showing respect doesn't mean accepting everything he says. Showing respect means expressing your disagreement with substance rather than with meaningless name calling.

[tuubi]

One word: PID1. Enough said.

PID1 - the magic word some people like to chant to ward off a perceived evil they just don't understand.

Wow, the unintentional (I promise) rhyming makes that come off weird, if not cringe-inducing. In non-rhyming english: Most experts don't see a problem where you do. The advantages of having a bit more functionality in PID1 are real and compelling to the people who understand this stuff, whereas the disadvantages are mostly theoretical.

[GreatEmerald]

PID1 - the magic word some people like to chant to ward off a perceived evil they just don't understand.

Not necessarily.

PID EINS!

[gens]

PID1 - the magic word some people like to chant to ward off a perceived evil they just don't understand.

Wow, the unintentional (I promise) rhyming makes that come off weird, if not cringe-inducing. In non-rhyming english: Most experts don't see a problem where you do. The advantages of having a bit more functionality in PID1 are real and compelling to the people who understand this stuff, whereas the disadvantages are mostly theoretical.

would you mind explaining why does it have to be pid 1 ?
i know why, and i know why it is bad
so please enlighten me just in case i am wrong
lennarts blog didn't explain bdw