Red Hat Pushing DNF 5 Into Development For Improving The Package Manager

[skeevy420]

You appear to be having a conversation with yourself about ZFS backup, which I have said nothing about and have zero interest in. But please, don't mind me, proceed...

You went with the generic example of "Pacman helper tools" so I used the non-generic example of "ZFS Pacman helpers in the AUR". You're acting like all Pacman helpers are only in the Core repository when they're all over the place.

Feel free to replace "ZFS Pacman helpers in the AUR" with the more generic "any Pacman helper in the AUR" comment.

If you were more specific with "Pacman helper tools in Arch/distribution repositories" then there wouldn't be such a gaping flaw in your argument.

[RahulSundaram]

This is all available under pacman or with its tools. Just because tools have been rolled directly into dnf doesn't change the actual behavior. End user doesn't give a crap if the package manager or its tools are doing the work.

What tools? Feel free to point me to said tools. Afaik pacman doesn't even store any of the requisite metadata, so I don't how any similar functionality is feasible

[andyprough]

You went with the generic example of "Pacman helper tools" so I used the non-generic example of "ZFS Pacman helpers in the AUR". You're acting like all Pacman helpers are only in the Core repository when they're all over the place.

Feel free to replace "ZFS Pacman helpers in the AUR" with the more generic "any Pacman helper in the AUR" comment.

If you were more specific with "Pacman helper tools in Arch/distribution repositories" then there wouldn't be such a gaping flaw in your argument.

You're way out ahead of me, I was talking about one specific tool for accessing pacman history. My pea-sized brain can't keep up with the ponderings of your megabrain, sorry.

[skeevy420]

You're way out ahead of me, I was talking about one specific tool for accessing pacman history. My pea-sized brain can't keep up with the ponderings of your megabrain, sorry.

Obviously. If one single statement about a ZFS Pacman helpers became "me having a conversation with myself about ZFS backups" then I'm not too surprised you weren't able to keep up.

[vb_linux]

As I said a few posts later https://www.phoronix.com/forums/foru...60#post1163660 I was talking in the context of system tools and applications, not payload applications where high performance matters.

I mean yes, Java is still very much faster and better than scripting languages for any serious application that needs performance.

So, asking as someone who has no experience in GUI for these tools ? What do they use GTK, QT with python bindings ?

[starshipeleven]

So, asking as someone who has no experience in GUI for these tools ? What do they use GTK, QT with python bindings ?

Python has bindings for GTK and Qt for basic stuff where you just want to throw up some basic windows with buttons https://python-gtk-3-tutorial.readth...simple-example
and this is provided by a package called python-gtk or python-qt5 (or similar) in most distros.
Or you can use its built-in GUI library tkinter https://www.geeksforgeeks.org/python-gui-tkinter/
There are also a bunch of library/bindings to control and interact with GNOME/KDE or system daemons.

For example, Virt-Manager https://virt-manager.org/ is an example of somewhat complex but purely utilitarian Python GUI application. Its performance isn't relevant as it's just a frontend for KVM/QEMU or other system daemons (dbus and SPICE among others).

Another such application (a VPN manager) is Qomui https://github.com/corrad1nho/qomui

For more complex and good-looking stuff there are like 10+ whole GUI frameworks, similar to what happens in Java. There is no shortage of frameworks in Python, it's a pretty big ecosystem now.

[modpunk]

And zypper gets no love. While I admit I'm partial to the apt-like syntax, it's speed and functionality have never left me disappointed.

zypper works just fine in Fedora. I'm using it daily on f31.

[StefanBruens]

Python has bindings for GTK and Qt for basic stuff where you just want to throw up some basic windows with buttons https://python-gtk-3-tutorial.readth...simple-example
and this is provided by a package called python-gtk or python-qt5 (or similar) in most distros.

Ultimaker Cura is written in python, and uses python-qt5: https://ultimaker.com/software/ultimaker-cura

[RahulSundaram]

Yes, I remember using it when I was a Fedora user. .. Filesystem snapshots are much more reliable and cover the common case of rolling back a bad update

Rolling back a bad update is far from the only one case for history and majority of use cases are not supported by filesystem snapshots which are not granular enough. For ex: Querying last update values or systematically reporting whether a package transaction was added via a dependency or user initiated

[Volta]

dnf just adds novelty features, while the core of the package manager languishes in utter disrepair.

dnf team: "Hey guys, maybe we should make our software not take 20 minutes to install a dozen small packages?"

The worst thing about it is the bash completion. It's a total nightmare. Not only it's utterly slow, but makes some irritating terminal sounds. However, there's some very good thing as well. It doesn't leave unneeded dependencies. When I install something with 40 dependencies I can be sure dnf will remove all of them. Sadly it's a feature that apt-get lacks.