Compiz 0.8.10 Released

[SorinN]

another 2 cents about Compiz 8 and 9 ..

There is NOTHING to be wrong about. I made a sarcastic statement towards your dumb statement

"Why not fork the cleaned up and modernized C++ based 0.9.XX code base? You know, the one that doesn't crash 3 times a day like I remember the 0.8.XX series did."

"I think C++ is superior in anyway and makes crash-resistant applications ...".

" ... C++ as if it's just an all-around superior language in every damn way.".

"Why? Why even bring up that C++ was used? The only fair point was that the 0.8.xx version was unmaintained ..."

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At first sight, there is a wrong assumption : " C++ is superior in anyway...".

C++ is not superior in ...anyway. Among programmers this statement is "De gustibus non est disputandum". Btw - Blender (the 3D opens source animation / modelling program) is coded mostly in C.

The second wrong assumption (on my opinion) is that Compiz 9.X must be better - well is not - in fact (at least for me) is a very disappointing list of releases on the 9.X series.
I've compiled a lot of Launchpad branches of Compiz 9 and I can tell you that for other DE's (other than Unity) Compiz 9.X is a disaster.

Sam Spilsbury did not finished his job entirely (porting C codebase to C++) - he takes away some plugins, Blur for example (or for me and many others Compiz without blur has no meaning [ because I want a desktop AS I WANT not as other may think is good for for me - this because we are an open source community not a bunch of microsoft teams doing anything but not their userbase demand ... ]). Another useful plugin was RollUp for Shade effect - I've used this plugin intensely on my workflow but when I've changed Compiz 8 with Compiz 9, I found I can read desktop items trough semi-opaque areas of my windows AND I can't use the RollUp effect. And the story can continue, we can talk all night about the Compiz 9 broken promises - but this is not the point. The real break point is that Compiz 9 was buggy and full of crashes - I don't care Compiz 9 recover and refresh itself in 2 seconds after crash - I don't like the idea of constantly being interrupted. All in all, I've tried many versions 9.X until I have found an almost stable version (0.9.11.2) - but 8.10 is far superior as I can tell you now (both in options and stability).

Compiz 8.10 did not crashed yet (at least for me). Therefore downgrading to 8.10, was a good move, I have my old functional desktop back (as it was under Ubuntu 10.4 with Gnome DE). Everything work - so regarding past Compiz 8.X crashes, I think that time is gone now - Compiz 8.10 codebase looks to be the most stable ever.

[Edogaa]

So... you are wrong and you are a dick. Gotcha.

There is NOTHING to be wrong about. I made a sarcastic statement towards your dumb statement

Just Why? Why the old un-maintained 0.8.XX series? Why not fork the cleaned up and modernized C++ based 0.9.XX code base? You know, the one that doesn't crash 3 times a day like I remember the 0.8.XX series did.

"Why not fork the cleaned up and modernized C++ based 0.9.XX code base? You know, the one that doesn't crash 3 times a day like I remember the 0.8.XX series did."

I think C++ is superior in anyway and makes crash-resistant applications is pretty much what this sounds like. They could've rewritten a better maintained version in C and it would probably still be better than the older code base of the time, if it's as bad as you say but you specifically said C++ as if it's just an all-around superior language in every damn way.

Why? Why even bring up that C++ was used? The only fair point was that the 0.8.xx version was unmaintained but that still doesn't take into account the amount of time it would take for the new maintainer to become familiar with a newer code base, whether he even knows C++ [similar enough languages, but different enough due to the addition of classes, new datatypes like auto, introduced in C++11, the fact that everything you can do in C can't be done in C++,incomplete datatypes are allowed in C-arrays but not C++ in most standard implementations, templates, and the entire C++ Standard Library], maybe he even has a technical reason for his interest in the older code base beyond familiarity or he just WANTS to do this. This isn't a business it is OSS.

[dh04000]

I'd be happy to see the 0.8 series continue development, as after fifteen years of using linux I feel like I've thrown together the perfect desktop for my purposes. Or, if the plugins I use ever get ported to 0.9, I'd probably give it a try.

Do you know how to code? If so, want to take a crack-at-it? smspillaz has said for years that these plugins could be ported if a community member wanted them, but he thought that the unported plugins were so messy and hacky and unreadable that he never bothered to try. Which is why they are unported to this day.

[dh04000]

I was making fun of your original statement being overly simplistic. Not whether they actually improved it or not, so idc.

So... you are wrong and you are a dick. Gotcha.

[psycho_driver]

Just Why? Why the old un-maintained 0.8.XX series? Why not fork the cleaned up and modernized C++ based 0.9.XX code base? You know, the one that doesn't crash 3 times a day like I remember the 0.8.XX series did.

Maybe for people like me who are still using the 0.8 series? I switched from E17 to compiz + cairo-dock (+ rox) a couple of years ago and have been very happy. I would have upgraded to the 0.9 branch but several of the plugins that I use are "among the handful" that haven't been ported to 0.9 yet.

When I was using the nvidia 334 drivers I had very good stability. My desktop would be up for a month or two at a time before restarts. My system would hit 6+ months of uptime. When I recently upgraded to the 346 drivers I experienced some crashing but by switching my app switcher plugin and turning off mipmaps in the window previews plugin it seems to have made everything stable again.

I'd be happy to see the 0.8 series continue development, as after fifteen years of using linux I feel like I've thrown together the perfect desktop for my purposes. Or, if the plugins I use ever get ported to 0.9, I'd probably give it a try.

PS - I'll always use something written in C vs. C++ if I have a choice and they're comparable feature-wise.

[Edogaa]

That wasn't my point at all. I didn't say that at all. This comment is 100% you. I don't know why you would think rewriting an entire application in C++ makes it stable and crash proof either.

The stability came due to the huge effort to fix up the code base by Spamzilla WHILE he was porting it to C++ and the efforts of testing by Canonical over the last ~3-4 years. That was the point I was making. Spamzilla ported to C++ from C because (1) He knows C++ better than C and (2) The old C base was so badly documented and messy that it wasn't worth saving, so why not convert to a code base that he understood and do a better job? At the time Spamzilla was the SOLE developer since everyone else had abandoned the project. He basically had free rein over the coding decisions. Until Canonical wanted to do Unity 7 on Compiz, Spamzilla was alone and must people on Phoronix/Community thought that Compiz was going to die.

There you go, a little history. Your welcome.

I was making fun of your original statement being overly simplistic. Not whether they actually improved it or not, so idc.

[johnc]

Back in my hayday of using compiz 8.04 to 10.04, I used to have between 3-6 crashes a day, especially when playing flash media. I was using a ATi X1400 then. Now-a-days on an optimus system (intel 3000 + nvidia 540m) I have a random lock up maybe once a month and a videogame related crash 1-3 times per month. Seems much better to me, but it might be hardware related. Whats your hardware?

I'm on a Core i7 870 and a GTX 570, but I think my crashes are related to games too because that's when I see them the most. Or XBMC when it goes fullscreen.

[dh04000]

I have to throw my anecdotal hat into the ring and say that compiz from about 12.04 on has been much worse for me than the prior iterations. Though I think that has less to do with Sam's work and more the effort to shoehorn Unity into a compiz plugin. Compiz on 11.04 (which is 0.9.4 I think) is pretty solid for me. I didn't have too many issues on 10.10 but it did crash on occasion. No more than it does on 14.04 today though. And even still on 14.04 I can not minimize all windows without hanging the system. (Which is a pretty basic desktop feature I think?)

Back in my hayday of using compiz 8.04 to 10.04, I used to have between 3-6 crashes a day, especially when playing flash media. I was using a ATi X1400 then. Now-a-days on an optimus system (intel 3000 + nvidia 540m) I have a random lock up maybe once a month and a videogame related crash 1-3 times per month. Seems much better to me, but it might be hardware related. Whats your hardware?

[dh04000]

Spamzilla? heh, not sure if trolling or honest mistake, but .. smspillaz is the name Sam Spilsbury uses. He has a blog here: http://smspillaz.wordpress.com/about/

My bad, I say "spamzilla" when I read smspillaz. It's a weird habit of mine. Yes, I meant smspillaz.



sm--sp--illa--z => sp--sm--z--illa ==> spamzilla (drops the S and adds an A) my brain does weird things sometimes.

[johnc]

The 0.9.XX series was a clean(Spamzilla rewrite), extremely well documented(Spamzilla and Canonical efforts), and well tested (Canonical Testing Software Efforts). The 0.8.XX series is "a big mess of code that actually works with a mess of patches..."

I have to throw my anecdotal hat into the ring and say that compiz from about 12.04 on has been much worse for me than the prior iterations. Though I think that has less to do with Sam's work and more the effort to shoehorn Unity into a compiz plugin. Compiz on 11.04 (which is 0.9.4 I think) is pretty solid for me. I didn't have too many issues on 10.10 but it did crash on occasion. No more than it does on 14.04 today though. And even still on 14.04 I can not minimize all windows without hanging the system. (Which is a pretty basic desktop feature I think?)