Qt-Powered Lumina Desktop 1.6 Released For BSD/Linux Systems

[kpedersen]

Furthermore XFCE lacks even basic features or functionality that even windows XP has had.

I think that is kind of the problem. You are right that Xfce is lacking features but so is KDE/plasma. All at the same time, Windows XP's desktop environment ran in less than 50Megs ram and consumed half the disk space as plasma alone.

This is honestly not me saying one DE is better than the other. I think they are all absolute trollop! I don't believe the open-source community is doing well here.

Unfortunately, new users coming from Windows don't have a clue about the problem. At the same time I am getting a general feeling that Linux veterans are burying their head in the sand and just telling themselves "everything is fine".

Also can you provide evidence that KDE is unmaintainable? Last time I checked it seems to be doing great.

Just check out the sheer number of patches required to it to build / run on different platforms (even different distros). Also you can kind of see by the fact that it is impossible to get KDE 3 compiling on a modern platform. If you project this by 10 years, we can safely make the same assumption that KDE5 will also be impossible to get compiling on a (then) modern platform.
Unless of course they start engineering in some preservation mechanisms into the code.

[240Hz]

Not at all. It is well known that KDE and Gnome are exceptionally bloated.
Run your package manager query of choice on something like Xfce and you will see a much more sane number of dependencies is output.

Obviously FreeBSD has "lite" meta-packages (i.e https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/ports.cg...me&sektion=all). This isn't the problem.

The issue still stands, these desktops are all still far too heavy to be maintainable. And for what? *Less* functionality than 10 years ago?

Number of packages does not mean more bloat. Some distros split their packages up into smaller more modular packages which leads to higher installed package count, while others like arch prefer bigger more bloated packages leading to a lower number installed packages. You are grasping at straws and being disingenuous.

Also can you provide evidence that KDE is unmaintainable? Last time I checked it seems to be doing great.

Furthermore XFCE lacks even basic features or functionality that even windows XP has had.

[kpedersen]

Quit while you're behind.

Not at all. It is well known that KDE and Gnome are exceptionally bloated.
Run your package manager query of choice on something like Xfce and you will see a much more sane number of dependencies is output.

Obviously FreeBSD has "lite" meta-packages (i.e https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/ports.cg...me&sektion=all). This isn't the problem.

The issue still stands, these desktops are all still far too heavy to be maintainable. And for what? *Less* functionality than 10 years ago?

This is the dependency list on OpenSUSE

zypper info --requires plasma5-desktop

That is not how you install plasma in a standard context... That will end up with just a mess (missing out most required packages).
I'm not convinced that you have managed to install even the window manager! Would you also not expect the KDE text editor to also be present as part of the DE?

Or are you trying to say that plasma isn't a desktop environment and in fact just a session manager?

(I am pretty sure this oversight has just managed to confuse some of the other members.)

[DanL]

This is xfce4 (a middle-weight DE) for comparison. There are less than half the number of dependencies!

Quit while you're behind.

[starshipeleven]

But does it only work on X11 or does it work on Wayland?

https://lumina-desktop.org/faq/
Lumina is currently only available on the X11 graphical system. The code-base is designed to be easily ported to another graphical system sometime down the road (only a single file to re-implement in the new system), but at the present moment, there is no scheduled time for any conversions to take place.

[uid313]

Nice with Linux support.
But does it only work on X11 or does it work on Wayland?

[starshipeleven]

This is xfce4 (a middle-weight DE) for comparison

Did you not understand that we said FreeBSD has bullshit packaging?
This only means that the xfce maintainer in FreeBSD is not as braindead as the Plasma one, but it still contains a bucket of crap that shouldn't be there to begin with.

Why the fuck did they add gstreamer, dmidecode, poppler and CUPS to xfce for example. That's not a dependency of the DE, that's secondary applications that work alone.

Plasma has too many components. There are too many things to break, leading to FOSS desktops being very fragile.

Stop this crap, half the packages or more in your list are NOT dependencies of Plasma at all, they are just marked as such in FreeBSD because they are lazy and can't make metapackages.

[kpedersen]

This is xfce4 (a middle-weight DE) for comparison

https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/ports.cgi?query=^xfce-4.14&stype=name

There are less than half the number of dependencies!

Plasma has too many components. There are too many things to break, leading to FOSS desktops being very fragile.

[starshipeleven]

How is plasma light in any possible way?

Just look at all these dependencies it drags in.

https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/ports.cgi?query=^plasma5-plasma-desktop-5.17.5_1

FreeBSD has traditionally adopted the bullshit way of dependency resolution aka "let's install everything remotely connected to it", and I think you know this as I think you said you preferred this bullshit way because it saves you time or something. You are being disingenuous if this is the case.

This is the dependency list on OpenSUSE

zypper info --requires plasma5-desktop

Information for package plasma5-desktop:
----------------------------------------
Repository     : repo-oss                          
Name           : plasma5-desktop                   
Version        : 5.17.5-2.1                        
Arch           : x86_64                            
Vendor         : openSUSE                          
Installed Size : 12.8 MiB                          
Installed      : Yes                               
Status         : up-to-date                        
Source package : plasma5-desktop-5.17.5-2.1.src    
Summary        : The KDE Plasma Workspace Components
Description    :                                   
    This package contains the basic packages for a Plasma workspace.
Requires       : [117]                             
    /bin/sh
    libstdc++.so.6()(64bit)
    libstdc++.so.6(GLIBCXX_3.4)(64bit)
    libstdc++.so.6(CXXABI_1.3)(64bit)
    libm.so.6()(64bit)
    libgcc_s.so.1()(64bit)
    libgcc_s.so.1(GCC_3.0)(64bit)
    libm.so.6(GLIBC_2.2.5)(64bit)
    libstdc++.so.6(GLIBCXX_3.4.21)(64bit)
    libglib-2.0.so.0()(64bit)
    libm.so.6(GLIBC_2.29)(64bit)
    libgcc_s.so.1(GCC_3.3.1)(64bit)
    libgobject-2.0.so.0()(64bit)
    libstdc++.so.6(GLIBCXX_3.4.9)(64bit)
    libQt5Core.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Core.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libstdc++.so.6(GLIBCXX_3.4.11)(64bit)
    libQt5Gui.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Gui.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libQt5Core.so.5(Qt_5.13)(64bit)
    libQt5Widgets.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Widgets.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libgio-2.0.so.0()(64bit)
    libX11.so.6()(64bit)
    libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.15)(64bit)
    libKF5CoreAddons.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5I18n.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Network.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Network.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libQt5DBus.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5DBus.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libKF5ConfigCore.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5WidgetsAddons.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Xml.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Xml.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libKF5ConfigWidgets.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5XmlGui.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Qml.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Qml.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libKF5ConfigGui.so.5()(64bit)
    libfreetype.so.6()(64bit)
    libKF5KIOWidgets.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5KIOCore.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5PrintSupport.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5PrintSupport.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libxcb.so.1()(64bit)
    libKF5Completion.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Quick.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5DBusAddons.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Quick.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libKF5IconThemes.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5X11Extras.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5X11Extras.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libKF5Service.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Svg.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Svg.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libfontconfig.so.1()(64bit)
    libQt5Sql.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Sql.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libKF5WindowSystem.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5Notifications.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5Archive.so.5()(64bit)
    libXi.so.6()(64bit)
    libXfixes.so.3()(64bit)
    libKF5Parts.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5JobWidgets.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5Codecs.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5ItemViews.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5KIOFileWidgets.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5QuickWidgets.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5QuickWidgets.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    libKF5NewStuff.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5GuiAddons.so.5()(64bit)
    libXft.so.2()(64bit)
    libKF5Wallet.so.5()(64bit)
    libXcursor.so.1()(64bit)
    libX11-xcb.so.1()(64bit)
    libKF5KCMUtils.so.5()(64bit)
    libphonon4qt5.so.4()(64bit)
    libKF5ItemModels.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Concurrent.so.5()(64bit)
    libQt5Concurrent.so.5(Qt_5)(64bit)
    kirigami2
    libKF5NotifyConfig.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5GlobalAccel.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5Solid.so.5()(64bit)
    libqt5-qtgraphicaleffects
    libKF5Declarative.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5SonnetUi.so.5()(64bit)
    libxkbfile.so.1()(64bit)
    libKF5Activities.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5Plasma.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5QuickAddons.so.5()(64bit)
    libibus-1.0.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5KDELibs4Support.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5AuthCore.so.5()(64bit)
    libxcb-xkb.so.1()(64bit)
    libKF5Package.so.5()(64bit)
    libxcb-keysyms.so.1()(64bit)
    libKF5Baloo.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5Runner.so.5()(64bit)
    libxcb-image.so.0()(64bit)
    libkworkspace5.so.5()(64bit)
    kde-user-manager
    kinfocenter5
    kmenuedit5
    ksysguard5
    libKF5PlasmaQuick.so.5()(64bit)
    libKF5Emoticons.so.5()(64bit)
    kactivities5-imports
    libKF5ActivitiesStats.so.1()(64bit)
    libnotificationmanager.so.1()(64bit)
    libtaskmanager.so.6()(64bit)
    libxcb-record.so.0()(64bit)
    plasma-framework-components >= 5.66.0
    plasma5-workspace >= 5.17.5
    /sbin/ldconfig

[240Hz]

Yeah, for example you can just install the WM component. However this is ricing and means that you are no longer running the Plasma desktop. Instead you are making your own non-standard setup using individual components. A corporate install for example would not do this.

You dont know what you are talking about. You can install KDE but there is no need to install all KDE apps and KDE games. This is not "ricing"

How is plasma light in any possible way?

Just look at all these dependencies it drags in.

https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/ports.cgi?query=^plasma5-plasma-desktop-5.17.5_1

Libvdpau? A lot of that is not even plasma, speaks more about Freebsd package maintainers.