I don't mind which way this goes, as long as SDL3 is better than SDL2 and it's easy to migrate, I'll update my code to remain relevant. I just wish that the desktop/Widget APIs on Wayland worked as nicely as they do on X11. Specifically GTK and tray icons/tray icon menus. At the moment it's a huge step backwards trying to run MATE and other desktops on GTK4/Wayland. I'd like GTK to either add the missing components back on, or have a formal extension system so other desktop groups can extend the API and keep their desktop environments working. There's far too much politicisation for/against Wayland adoption.
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SDL Developers Weigh Reverting Wayland Over X11 For SDL 3.0
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Any alternative to Wayland would end up having the same problems so I'm not quite sure what people are dragging on about.
Is it bad that Wayland development has hurt its real world usage? Yes.
Is it the fault of the protocol itself, no.
This is 100% a people caused problem, Wayland protocol proposals are filled with drama and arguments, including people telling Valve developers their needs are wrong (cause you know, Valve obviously has no idea how games should work).
Wayland is needed because it aligns to how graphics hardware works that allows "modern features", the stubbornness over protocol additions have caused this.Last edited by Britoid; 27 March 2024, 06:19 AM.
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Originally posted by S.Pam View PostAccording to https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/X_Window_System the X11 protocol was finalised 1987, three years after initial release.
​​​​​​Wayland had its initial release 15 years ago, and its ecosystem is still not feature complete, comparatively.
​​Last edited by Volta; 27 March 2024, 06:46 AM.
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Originally posted by AmericanLocomotive View PostHDR wasn't even possible from a technological point of view until very recently. LED backlight, LCD panel and OLED technology were not able to handle the brightness levels required. A proper HDR display needs to achieve peak brightness levels 3-4x higher than a standard "desktop" display.
The real problem is that historically OLED has been insanely expensive until the past 5 or so years.Last edited by mdedetrich; 27 March 2024, 07:45 AM.
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Originally posted by pracedru View PostSome of the features of X11 was not well thought out. These features need to go and the applications that use them will not work in the future without some modifications. This is the way it has to be.
When users run several instances of my application, they can quickly recognize which instance they want to switch to, by looking at the icon on system tray.
On Wayland, I can't even set my own application icon, much less change it on the fly.
This is possible on all other desktop GUI systems, from Windows to Mac.
Now please explain to me how all the other systems were designed by idiots, and Wayland has been well thought out.
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Originally posted by energyman View Post
typical of computing.
Big Iron from the 60s were replaced by cheaper minis that lacked many features.
minis were replaced by commodity servers, that lacked many features
everything was replaced by x86 which lacked many features
...
and today people are jubilant about virtualisation and 'containers' - which is 60 year old tech....
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Originally posted by anda_skoa View Post
Aren't tray icons/menus already handled via D-Bus and thus independent of whether the desktop session is on X11 or Wayland?
Since like ages ago?
Yeah. KDE started using that spec with KDE 4 because XEmbed doesn't work reliably with things like alpha-blended icon backdrops, displaying icons in an overflow menu, displaying the same icon at multiple sizes in more than one place, etc.
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Originally posted by dpeterc View Post
I develop X11 based application which defines its own icon based on its contents.
When users run several instances of my application, they can quickly recognize which instance they want to switch to, by looking at the icon on system tray.
On Wayland, I can't even set my own application icon, much less change it on the fly.
This is possible on all other desktop GUI systems, from Windows to Mac.
Now please explain to me how all the other systems were designed by idiots, and Wayland has been well thought out.
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