X.Org Server 1.19 Proposed For Release Next Month

[Anvil]

I haven't ran it from as my day-tol-day setup. I've just briefly tested for a few minutes.
It seems to work pretty fine. All GNOME applications work.
Problems I've noticed in Ubuntu 16.10 beta is that GNOME Terminal has a ugly shadow, and Evince has ugly window decorators.

Ubuntu is ugly fullstop , but Gnome an Wayland is not ready to be default, a bit like Mir/XMir an Ubuntu , not ready

[jrch2k8]

Well on Archlinux, i've been using for a while now Gnome-Wayland 3.21+(from gnome-devel repo) with Xorg-1.19-git(AUR) + Linux4.8rc(from Miffe) + Mesa/LLVM-git and MPV git and didn't realize it(Gnome-3.22 swtiches to wayland by default and i didn't actually realize it)at all.

So yeah, 0 crashes, 0 glitches, even my browsers work 100% as expected(Opera, Chromium + flash, Firefox, Qupzilla), Kdevelop 5/netbeans worked seamlessly, GIMP/Blender/Digikam/Openshot/Kdenlive worked seamlessly too.

I actually noticed because show applications on dash-to-dock render a bit slow sometimes and it made curious enough to check in system-details and goddamn it was wayland all along :O

All my graphic hardware is AMD using Modesetting driver(i removed all others since i think works better this way on both Xorg and Wayland), i don't have intel iGPU system(Xeon-1230v3, xeon-1220v3, AMD FX 6100, AMD FX 8350) so you mileage may vary depending the GPU.

Of Course Archlinux have all latest vanilla software too like libinput/sdl2/xdg-shell/etc. So on other release distros i don't know if all dependencies are there and if they are there are recent enough and that may cause crashes, additionally Intel stability is kinda a shotting gallery and heavily depends the date your distro choosed to branch their git snapshot.

So, All i can say for sure is on AMD hardware with Archlinux gnome-3.22 on wayland is almost seamlessly usable against Xorg session and btw the cursor glitch on wayland when gaming seems gone when patching SDL2 library and using gnome-3.22(Disclaimer as tested in few games on my systems)

[Mateus Felipe]

it's so embarrassing using linux as a desktop because of X. I hope it will die soon. Usually I use Ubuntu-Unity on a GTX970 and is a pain every time I use it, But every desktops environment run very bad because of X.
I'm trying right know to switch to Gnome Shell on wayland (with the igpu not the gtx970) with some extensions to make it operate like Unity (Pixel Saver, dash-to-dock, activities-configurator and some indicators) and I feel very satisfied, I miss only the embedded menu on the windows title (I don't like how Gnome3 manage app's menu).
Someone have some suggestion about a good graphic card with a best opensource driver able to handle wayland without lag and stutter?

I feel the same. I know that X11 is still broadly used, but it's not a reason to keep updating it, since it will only slow the transition to Wayland. I use GNOME/Wayland with no issues since 2015 (surely, I'm not using NVIDIA or AMD, it would be problematic) and it's fair good. Hope everyone get it ready soon.

[franglais125]

All my graphic hardware is AMD using Modesetting driver

Just curious. Are they integrated GPUs? Or do you have AMD discrete cards on those machines (for the Xeon one at least I guess)?

I'm asking because if Show applications from dash-to-dock is slow with a discrete card (even if on Wayland)... well, that sucks a bit :/

[starshipeleven]

I feel the same. I know that X11 is still broadly used, but it's not a reason to keep updating it, since it will only slow the transition to Wayland. I use GNOME/Wayland with no issues since 2015 (surely, I'm not using NVIDIA or AMD, it would be problematic) and it's fair good. Hope everyone get it ready soon.

I repeat, not all developers working on x11 are doing it for linux.

[jrch2k8]

Just curious. Are they integrated GPUs? Or do you have AMD discrete cards on those machines (for the Xeon one at least I guess)?

I'm asking because if Show applications from dash-to-dock is slow with a discrete card (even if on Wayland)... well, that sucks a bit :/

Both Xeon are using r9-280 3GB TAHITI cards and both AMD are using HD7770 Cape Verde Cards.

Btw is not slow render per se, the problem is on mutter side since is partially Xwayland and Wayland, so you notice in some functions that make it switch from one to the other like show applications on dash-to-dock. This should be fixed in Gnome-24 where i believe is in the TODO to remove Xwayland from mutter itself and make a pure Wayland compositor on Wayland(XWayland just for the APPS).

Kwin is doing something like this too, Kwin_x11 is completely XCB while kwin_wayland is using only Wayland, that way they avoid the constant switching

[Guest]

People who should be hating on X are developers who are forced to develop for it, not end users.
Xorg has actually gotten so much fucking better in recent years and apart from very niche cases I can't think of a reason why user could complain (optimus laptop users, multiscreen-multigpu users, ...). Most of old Xorg design flaws were solved by modern UI toolkits and Xorg extensions (most notably DRIx and xlib->xcb transition).

[Guest]

My only major issue with Wayland is the lack-of ability to change gamma. A lot of screens I see look really washed out at the default 1.0 gamma, but calibrate nicely when at 0.8 (not sure if this is because of the panel type or what). As I understand, this also affects things like Redshift.

Also as I understand, NVIDIA and Wayland developers still can't agree on some standard way which means that NVIDIA's proprietary driver won't work on Wayland. This alone probably eliminates a large group of users from using Wayland (nouveau isn't an option for Maxwell and Pascal for users wanting to do more than basic 2D at least until reclocking comes).

As nice as Wayland sounds, those two reasons above prevent me from using it. On the other hand, Xorg isn't too bad either for me really want to rush to using Wayland. My only real gripe with it currently is the tearing on Optimus hardware, and it looks like NVIDIA has a solution for that finally that should land in 1.19.

[sp82]

People who should be hating on X are developers who are forced to develop for it, not end users.
Xorg has actually gotten so much fucking better in recent years and apart from very niche cases I can't think of a reason why user could complain (optimus laptop users, multiscreen-multigpu users, ...). Most of old Xorg design flaws were solved by modern UI toolkits and Xorg extensions (most notably DRIx and xlib->xcb transition).

"Daniel Stone: what one thing is X doing and what is it doing well?"
here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWQh_DmDLKQ

[franglais125]

Both Xeon are using r9-280 3GB TAHITI cards and both AMD are using HD7770 Cape Verde Cards.

Btw is not slow render per se, the problem is on mutter side since is partially Xwayland and Wayland, so you notice in some functions that make it switch from one to the other like show applications on dash-to-dock. This should be fixed in Gnome-24 where i believe is in the TODO to remove Xwayland from mutter itself and make a pure Wayland compositor on Wayland(XWayland just for the APPS).

Kwin is doing something like this too, Kwin_x11 is completely XCB while kwin_wayland is using only Wayland, that way they avoid the constant switching

Thanks a lot for the detailed response! That sounds more promising and exciting