X Window System Turns 38 Years Old

[birdie]

Bullshit. WDDM being new was at least half of the reason Vista was the shitshow it was.

You remember it wrong. There was an issue with minimum system requirements and Intel cheating with their atrocious GPUs but that had nothing to do with Windows. WDDM worked perfectly and I don't remember any applications misbehaving due to it.

Wayland on the other hand breaks almost everything: global shortcuts, systray, screen casting/recording, automation, etc. etc. etc. I remember they dragged for years the support for basic stuff like drag-n-drop and clipboard.

Lastly Windows 10 can work on a fucking rock which supports VESA 2.0 while Mutter/KWin won't even launch on that.

Wayland developers: "let's break everything and make sure you've got proper drivers or GTFO".

[archkde]

You are right, but then X11 could do things like setting resolution or data query (retrieve window list or mouse position), whereas Wayland cannot do that.... in the name of security (and nobody thought of the permission system!!!).

You see, this argument will go nowhere. I can also say I can blow out a candle but not a lightbulb. What matters is having a usable desktop. Nobody except some developers need to care whether the resolution is set (or the window list retrieved) via Wayland or DBus.

[tildearrow]

People expecting useless and niche features on Wayland just because they got them on stupid xorg. -_-

Because some of these features allowed us to easily boost our productivity.

[arun54321]

People expecting useless and niche features on Wayland just because they got them on stupid xorg. -_-

[tildearrow]

Your argument is flawed as well. "Cars can move and more" or "electricity can power a light bulb and more", while correct, are the analog of saying "Wayland can display framebuffers and more".

You are right, but then X11 could do things like setting resolution or data query (retrieve window list or mouse position), whereas Wayland cannot do that.... in the name of security (and nobody thought of the permission system!!!).

[archkde]

This is why Wayland is not getting any better - you compare X11 to something old but still functional and Wayland to something new, without realizing its flaws.

Your comparison is totally wrong because in the first three points, the former has ALL features of the latter (cars can move and more, electricity can power a light bulb and more, and the Internet can do fax and more); but in the last point, the former cannot do everything the latter could (for the most part it makes sense, e.g. you don't want fonts/primitive rendering in your protocol, but for SOME things, like data query or setting resolution, it doesn't make sense).
I can't believe people still do not realize Wayland is still lacking...

Your argument is flawed as well. "Cars can move and more" or "electricity can power a light bulb and more", while correct, are the analog of saying "Wayland can display framebuffers and more".

[tildearrow]

Why should Gnome shoot itself in the foot by adopting old mistakes into a modern protocol.

Why should two processes be responsible for drawing one window, it was madness in the past and never properly worked, why in gods name should we do that BS again.

KDE adopted that because why should they care if something sucks, producing a desktop that sucks is in their DNA.

Again there already is a proper solution, which is either already adopted by the usual "toolkits" like SDL2. https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pa...L2-Wayland-CSD

Disagreements between developers is why Wayland progress is slow.

[tildearrow]

there are people that act like that whenever there is a technical innovation.

* who need cars? horses are just fine and car are dangerous and get stuck in mud.
* who need electricity? candles are good enough, and are not as dangerous as electricity is.
* who need the internet? Faxes are working perfectly, email is clunky!
* who need wayland? there are several case where X11 works out of the box! Just stay with it forever!

This is why Wayland is not getting any better - you compare X11 to something old but still functional and Wayland to something new, without realizing its flaws.

Your comparison is totally wrong because in the first three points, the former has ALL features of the latter (cars can move and more, electricity can power a light bulb and more, and the Internet can do fax and more); but in the last point, the former cannot do everything the latter could (for the most part it makes sense, e.g. you don't want fonts/primitive rendering in your protocol, but for SOME things, like data query or setting resolution, it doesn't make sense).
I can't believe people still do not realize Wayland is still lacking...

[archkde]

The Wayland approach looks interesting, but anything that starts off with a chmod 777 disturbs my security hinky sense.

You're right, the shown command allows all users to access the Wayland socket instead of just <account_name>. Use

setfacl -m user:<account_name>:rwx

instead to only grant access for the desired user.

[archkde]

Microsoft completely reworked the graphics stack in Windows Vista, no one even noticed.

Bullshit. WDDM being new was at least half of the reason Vista was the shitshow it was.