Well it seems that when the power of bitchyness is greater than the power of collaboration to get things done. It really feels like a reactionary move done almost as much out of spite than for technical reasons. Seriously it took canonical saying "your solution isn't good enough, we're rolling our own" for gnome to get off it's arse and actually get wayland support under way. How long would it have taken if canonical had instead depended on gnome doing it in their own time? Certainly too long to be of use for a mobile platform that's launching in October. And from what i've seen, canonical's contributions would be turned down only for the equivalent functionality to be re-implemented in an incompatible way about 2 years after they'd be of use to anyone (notifications anyone?)
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Originally posted by mangecoeur View PostWell it seems that when the power of bitchyness is greater than the power of collaboration to get things done. It really feels like a reactionary move done almost as much out of spite than for technical reasons. Seriously it took canonical saying "your solution isn't good enough, we're rolling our own" for gnome to get off it's arse and actually get wayland support under way. How long would it have taken if canonical had instead depended on gnome doing it in their own time? Certainly too long to be of use for a mobile platform that's launching in October. And from what i've seen, canonical's contributions would be turned down only for the equivalent functionality to be re-implemented in an incompatible way about 2 years after they'd be of use to anyone (notifications anyone?)
In brief: "Canonical: We go to Wayland". GNOME makes several trials. Then Canonical does not communicate and changes direction without informing.
Canonical is the one not communicating here and keeping things private. Wtf with calling GNOME reactionary? Note that we already have done loads of work for Wayland.
PS: Wayland != GNOME.
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Originally posted by agd5f View PostRegardless of whether you prefer wayland or mir, both are currently lacking a certain amount of what some would call essential functionality in comparison to X. Off the top of my head:
- Multi-GPU support
- Hybrid laptop (PowerXpress, Optimus) support
- modeswitching API
- multi-display API
These are obviously not insurmountable, but still a lot of work. Just something to keep in mind.
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Originally posted by bkor View PostWtf with calling GNOME reactionary? Note that we already have done loads of work for Wayland.
PS: Wayland != GNOME.
I've tried to follow most of the discussions regardign the move but here's what I still don't get:
Which single component requires the most work for GNOME to default to Wayland in something not overly conservative but aimed at a large number of users, like Fedora? Is it the protocol? Weston (even relevant?)? Mutter? Gtk? or something else?Last edited by Kostas; 13 March 2013, 10:44 AM.
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Originally posted by iniudan View PostI am pretty sure even X doesn't have that, or did Torvald cursing Nvidia actually had an effect I never heard of ? Cause if yes, I want the solution, my thinkpad would appreciate it. =p
X gets lots of flack (some of it justified, much of it not), but it has loads of functionality which is extremely useful in corner cases, and which some of us need. Wayland is aiming at covering the most common use cases first, before tackling such stuff. So I expect X to be a factor for a long time to come.
I don't know how exactly this is handled, but I can not use a system without working multi-seat. This requires multi-seat aware login manager and multi-seat aware input handling. I don't think that this works in Wayland right now, or that it is much of a priority. Just one example.
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Originally posted by Kostas View PostI've tried to follow most of the discussions regardign the move but here's what I still don't get:
Which single component requires the most work for GNOME to default to Wayland in something not overly conservative but aimed at a large number of users, like Fedora? Is it the protocol? Weston (even relevant?)? Mutter? Gtk? or something else?
If you want to see what needs to be done: https://live.gnome.org/Wayland
It has a list of applications and if they work on Wayland or not. It also lists all the things that needs to be done.
High level speaking the most critical components are: Mutter, GTK+. Everything is being investigated and written down on above link.
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Originally posted by bkor View PostThat's odd, because Canonical did the same thing with Unity: Developed it internally, never communicated.
We had a design hackfest where Canonical did their own meetings.
So interesting that you seem to have more knowledge about this... care to cite your references?
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