XWayland 21.1.3 Released With Support For NVIDIA's 495 Driver GBM

[omer666]

In 2006, I was running Quake 4 on my Ubuntu PC & Nvidia 7600gs with a higher frame rate than on Windows XP.
Ubuntu felt kind of feature complete, compiz made the desktop snappy and beautiful, the web was fast, editors were fast...

I suspect Microsoft was like: "let's destroy this perfectly working system from within" and hence they secretly funded Wayland and gnome3... Now, in 2021 we are in a state were everything is just worse... The "new" hasn't arrived yet (gnome Wayland GBM Nvidia gaming), the old is abandonware (X).

Luckily, I can just use e.g. Kubuntu on X with a Radeon to have a superb user experience, but it saddens me to see how fragmentation has harmed some areas of the Linux ecosphere...

A completely nonsensical attempt at trolling. How on earth did Wayland or ...Gnome 3 (???) alter your framerate?

And if you think they are responsible for fragmenting the Linux ecosystem, it show how little you know about Linux.

[piotrj3]

A completely nonsensical attempt at trolling. How on earth did Wayland or ...Gnome 3 (???) alter your framerate?

And if you think they are responsible for fragmenting the Linux ecosystem, it show how little you know about Linux.

Well X stuff run via Xwayland on Wayland... what increases latency and drops a little performance. And as long as Wine/Proton doesn't run nativly on Wayland or fix it other way around, X will remain the "better" choice for gaming.

To be honest, I take a big laugh at this thread. Patches for Xwayland just arrived and some people here expect instantly KDE, Gnome and other stuff will instantly run using GBM in their outdated distros, lol. Even if distos were up to date like Arch, there still needs to be patches done on side of KDE/Gnome and even then probably tons of random bugs will appear as specification of those standards is quite poor.

[bug77]

Well X stuff run via Xwayland on Wayland... what increases latency and drops a little performance. And as long as Wine/Proton doesn't run nativly on Wayland or fix it other way around, X will remain the "better" choice for gaming.

To be honest, I take a big laugh at this thread. Patches for Xwayland just arrived and some people here expect instantly KDE, Gnome and other stuff will instantly run using GBM in their outdated distros, lol. Even if distos were up to date like Arch, there still needs to be patches done on side of KDE/Gnome and even then probably tons of random bugs will appear as specification of those standards is quite poor.

Tbh the GBM path has already been tested, there shouldn't be many problems there.

[Myownfriend]

X is feature complete

It notably isn't. Stuff like HDR, mixed refresh rates, and mixed DPI scaling will never come to it.

I suspect Microsoft was like: "let's destroy this perfectly working system from within" and hence they secretly funded Wayland and gnome3

How come everybody with a hate-boner for Wayland is a poorly-read conspiracy theorist?

[Myownfriend]

To be honest, I take a big laugh at this thread. Patches for Xwayland just arrived and some people here expect instantly KDE, Gnome and other stuff will instantly run using GBM in their outdated distros, lol. Even if distos were up to date like Arch, there still needs to be patches done on side of KDE/Gnome and even then probably tons of random bugs will appear as specification of those standards is quite poor.

There are so many people who act like X11 is a such a natural interface between client and servers that no applications or DEs ever needed to build-in support for it, they just naturally understood X11. A prime example of that is the "Boycott Wayland" gist lol

[oiaohm]

Well X stuff run via Xwayland on Wayland... what increases latency and drops a little performance. And as long as Wine/Proton doesn't run nativly on Wayland or fix it other way around, X will remain the "better" choice for gaming.

This here is truly false hood. We have the bebenchmarks of gamescope from valve. This is a wayland compositor being gamescape running on X11 as a client with XWayland under it running proton applications. Guess what the performance and latency difference is in 99.9% of cases inside margin of error to running straight on the X11 server without gamescope.

Reasons for this on the graphical side most of the time you are using opengl/vulkan/.... basically bipassing the X11/Wayland protocols for general operations. Input pass though wayland is highly effective.

https://github.com/Plagman/gamescope

The reality here is as soon as Valve can they will cease supporting games on bare metal X11. Yes games you buy though the steam market place in future will only be tested using Xwayland. If you are using X11 bare metal you will have gamescope in the middle. Valve wants to reduce down to exactly 2 applications that support X11 bare metal. that the steam client and gamescope.

[dec05eba]

Wayland still has some issues with nvidia proprietary drivers. It doesn't seem to support hardware cursor and applications randomly glitch out. I guess others using nvidia with wayland are actually using nouveau?

[dec05eba]

It notably isn't. Stuff like HDR, mixed refresh rates, and mixed DPI scaling will never come to it.



How come everybody with a hate-boner for Wayland is a poorly-read conspiracy theorist?

kinda ironic how you say others are conspiracy theorists when you continue stating the false claim that x11 doesn't support HDR (and never will), when it already does. As for mixed DPI, there is a patch to fix it in xwayland and when that gets merged it will be trivial to add it outside xwayland as well.
Here is me using hdr on x11:
hdr-chromium.jpg
and as you can see even chromium detects it and it works with youtube

[oiaohm]

kinda ironic how you say others are conspiracy theorists when you continue stating the false claim that x11 doesn't support HDR (and never will), when it already does. As for mixed DPI, there is a patch to fix it in xwayland and when that gets merged it will be trivial to add it outside xwayland as well.

Mixed DPI will be trivial inside xwayland but not not trivial inside X11 bare metal. The problem is how X11 protocol designed X11 compositor to plug in so their are quite a few changes required to this protocol so Mixed DPi works correctly. Please also note xwayland gets to nuke the logic of all screens on one global image so for mixed dpi never had to solve that problem..

The HDR issue is the meant to support legacy SDR applications at the same time. Nvidia has proposed a X11 protocol change to support legacy SDR on HDR screen.

dec05eba the reality here X11 protocol does not properly support HDR with SDR application yet. Yes you site you tested claimed HDR support was a myth while using Nvidia drivers that have basically hacked up X11 protocol with a non merged extension.

https://dec05eba.com/2021/10/10/x11-myth-x11-doesnt-support-hdr/

which is not an issue with x11 itself. Its an issue with gimp

No you are wrong here. Supporting legacy applications is part of the X11 protocol.

https://www.x.org/wiki/Events/XDC2017/goins_hdr.pdf

This is the Nvidia proposed change in 2017 that would have seen gimp render correctly. Due to no active maintainer of X.org X11 server at that time this fix did not proceed. So does x11 protocol support HDR as well as it should absolutely not.

So your complete myth post is pushing a stack of myths because you don't know the stuff as you should. HDR in X11 server is half implemented at best at this stage.

[Myownfriend]

kinda ironic how you say others are conspiracy theorists when you continue stating the false claim that x11 doesn't support HDR (and never will), when it already does...

Here is me using hdr on x11:
hdr-chromium.jpg
and as you can see even chromium detects it and it works with youtube

That's quite possibly the dumbest way that you could have tried to make that point. All that screenshot is showing is that you can request HDR content from Youtube. That isn't even proof that it's using it since it's on Auto.

Neither X11 nor Wayland support HDR. Even setting X11 to 10bpc, which is required for supporting HDR, actually breaks a lot of X11 applications.

https://www.collabora.com/news-and-b...dynamic-range/

https://forum.level1techs.com/t/stat...te-2020/162563

https://www.reddit.com/r/linux_gamin...less_on_linux/

kinda ironic

Even if you were right then that wouldn't be "ironic" because I never said anything that could be considered a conspiracy. I'd just be wrong.

As for mixed DPI, there is a patch to fix it in xwayland and when that gets merged it will be trivial to add it outside xwayland as well.

That's not how that works. XWayland is just an Xserver contained in a Wayland client. It's doesn't extend the X11 protocol in anyway. The MR is literally called "Multi DPI support via global factor rescaling". It's just scaling clients the same way that X currently does. The difference is that, as a Wayland client, it can send it pre-scaled cursor coordinates and rescale the client buffers before passing them to the compositor for final scaling.