Originally posted by JackLilhammers
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GNOME 40 Mutter Moves Input Work To A Separate Thread
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Originally posted by S.Pam View PostI was using multi-threaded applications on the Amiga days... What happened - why isn't important and critical things not in separate worker threads already?Last edited by pal666; 28 November 2020, 01:16 PM.
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Originally posted by oiaohm View PostThe answer is no that is not correct.
http://software.cfht.hawaii.edu/man/x11/XInitThreads(3x)
Horrible reality if you don't call XinitThreads x.org server from your windows manager and compositor(if you have one) x.org gets to go back to being pure single threaded supply of stuff to the windows manager and compositor.
Not exactly. You may have mouse pointer moving correctly(because of X.org server drawing it) but you can have a lot of action lag because windows manager/compositor don't have their input handling running on a different thread to the other processing so there are extra delays on input. Wayland really just makes this fault in face and show stopper. X.org server masks over it a bit but is not a 100 percent cure if you are getting into low latency response requirements.
Yes biggest in the face flaw with Gnome Wayland but its a problem in design that also effects X11 users just less human noticeable due to how humans work. Its the fun one confirmed by studies that you can take 1/3 longer for your application starting by adding a splash screen to entertain human and the humans will say it faster when by wall clock it slower. X11 server keeping the mouse cursor moving entertains the human so the human take longer to notice that action processing is stalled out. Giving users good UX experience is part these distractions so users don't notice what is happening really. Of course you will have some highly observant will will see straight though the magic trick slide of hands
Even if input was multi-threaded, Wayland will still become totally frozen on heavy loads where all CPU cores are pinged to 100%. Wayland's protocol is totally inadequate for desktop compositors. Wayland's scope is -waaay- too narrow. There is nothing that any compositor can do to make Wayland -NOT- feel laggy. It -will- be laggy because the protocol doesn't have the concepts necessary.
EDIT: Currently most distro's use a cgroups hack to give Wayland compositors maximum CPU priority above all other loads and that can hide input lag on moderate loads. But it doesn't fix the problem, it just hides the problem.Last edited by duby229; 28 November 2020, 01:15 PM.
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Originally posted by lakerssuperman View PostThis is amazing. One of my last and largest issues with Gnome on Wayland is the laggy cursor. If this change fixes that issue, I think I will finally be on Wayland full time!!
When using Gnome, every few days you need to refresh your session (on Xorg via alt + F2 + r) or RAM goes berserk (3-4x the clean use), but this trick doesn't work on wayland, leaving you with a RAM usage going wild every. single. time. after a while of uptime. I don't want to go through the hassle of saving everything, logging out and back in to solve that. Especially when you have an ongoing workflow.
I just don't understand why they didn't implement this refresh feature in wayland. It's kind of dumb since it's a recurring Gnome issue.
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Originally posted by uid313 View PostI hope they make GNOME more robust too. It is not so robust. Sometimes it crashes, sometimes it freezes. Under Wayland that will bring down the whole compositor.
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Originally posted by wertigon View PostAmiga had a cooperative multi threading model and no memory protections. That allows a whole lot more performance at the cost of security, which also allowed the Amiga to punch above it's weight.
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Originally posted by dragon321 View PostOn X11 it's X Server job to handle input and window manager/compositor is separate process.
http://software.cfht.hawaii.edu/man/x11/XInitThreads(3x)
Horrible reality if you don't call XinitThreads x.org server from your windows manager and compositor(if you have one) x.org gets to go back to being pure single threaded supply of stuff to the windows manager and compositor.
Originally posted by dragon321 View PostOn Wayland compositor does everything that X Server does so it needs to handle input as well. Obviously such patches are not needed for X.Org session..
Originally posted by dragon321 View PostFinally. It was probably one of the biggest (if not biggest) flaw in GNOME Wayland session. It was very annoying seeing cursor lags with heavy IO. I hope it will be finally gone with these patches.
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Originally posted by 144Hz View PostJackLilhammers Why PopOS?- When I try out something on Linux I usually do on Ubuntu based distributions
- PopOS is more user friendly for Nvidia and Optimus laptops
- I'm not a huge fan of Fedora
- There are lots of other options available, but IMHO for testing just Gnome is not worth exploring alternatives
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Originally posted by ix900 View PostOkay, we now know your love for Amiga lol. Sadly, it wasn't impressive enough to have gone anywhere. You can cuddle it in a blanket and rock it to sleep if you want.
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