Devuan: Debian Without Systemd

[scjet]

Free-of-SystemD'uh

Devuan (Linux), will be Free-of-SystemD'uh" -so how do you like us now ?

[BlackStar]

I would also like to respectfully ask people to stop quoting the trolls, please! Have a nice day.

Hey isn't that the spirit of Phoronix Forums? Trolls trolling trolls ad nauseam.

Debian+systemd is perfect. The only downside is that this didn't happen sooner - we Arch users have been enjoying the advantages of systemd for two years now.

[Alejandro Nova]

The more I read about projects to free Linux from the curse of systemd/pulseaudio/Lennartware in general, the more I become a personal fan of Lennart. That says all.

[kpedersen]

I rekon in a year or so, this fork will be dead. But it will have died purely because Debian has gone back to SysVinit (or another correct init system) and this fork was no longer needed

[GreatEmerald]

Debian+systemd is perfect. The only downside is that this didn't happen sooner - we Arch users have been enjoying the advantages of systemd for two years now.

That's not really surprising. Debian is a conservative distribution, after all.

The more I read about projects to free Linux from the curse of systemd/pulseaudio/Lennartware in general, the more I become a personal fan of Lennart. That says all.

Yea, I pretty much agree.

[brosis]

This is not problematic.

Problematic will be, when stuff breaks in Devuan, yet works perfectly in Debian.

Either way, it is good news. I love PulseAudio and Systemd, and finally there will be reduce in hate posts and people finally using what they want so.

[Luke_Wolf]

If Debian decided go with Upstart or stay as it was no way in hell UBUNTU would have gone with systemd and same goes to all Debian & UBUNTU derivates. UBUNTU didn't choose systemd. It was a choice imposed to UBUNTU by Debian. At most, if Debian had choose stay as they were, UBUNTU had abandon Upstart and gone back to same init than Debian is using up to now. Like i said previously, upstream decides and all derivates sooner or later "get with the program".

I disagree. If Debian had chosen anything other than systemd Ubuntu would have stuck on Upstart. The reason that Ubuntu switched with Debian to systemd is that they were the last ecosystem with a significant number of developers left not having done so. Which means that the burden of maintaining the non-systemd ecosystem fell on them, a few gentoo devs, and the slackware devs, and they realized that that was way too much work.

Let's say purely hypothetically that Debian had stuck with sysv or switched to OpenRC though, because Debian would now be forced to develop a logind replacement and maintain an ecosystem that didn't rely on systemd, Ubuntu could just ride on their backs and continue using Upstart without having to worry too much for the time being. Eventually the force of the systemd ecosystem would have caused 1 of 2 things:
A). A set of tools is finally made which provides all of the DBUS apis that systemd provides for other init systems
B). Caused Debian and Ubuntu to finally give up and switch to systemd anyway

The reason why systemd is basically becoming the only choice anymore is because so far only the BSDs have sat down and said, let's do A, all of the people against systemd on the Linux side just complained and did basically nothing, which meant that no replacement implementation software for Linux occurred which meant that Debian was basically forced to choose systemd unless they wanted to reimplement all of those APIs. Those against systemd have had years to provide an alternative to logind but nothing happened (Which kinda implies the exact opposite of what Ryao said, if the people against systemd were all experienced devs and sys admins we'd have a logind replacement by now) which means desktop devs are forced to support logind because they have no alternative (Consolekit is dead, and not an option). Say whatever else you want, but the fault for DEs relying upon systemd specific functionality lies on the heads of those opposing systemd for not providing an alternative despite having years to do so.

[scjet]

Hey isn't that the spirit of Phoronix Forums? Trolls trolling trolls ad nauseam.

Debian+systemd is perfect. The only downside is that this didn't happen sooner - we Arch users have been enjoying the advantages of systemd for two years now.

You "Arch users", and I include myself loosely here, didn't have the balls, courage, or fotitude to stand up and "fork" Arch, whereas, Devuan has, and atleast they will "try" to do it.

Now go and enjoy your Poetterix-OS, by all means.

[scjet]

"Rage, rage against the dying of the light" -Dylan Thomas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mRec3VbH3w

Cheers to Devuan ! for not going gently into the night, and let us be forever rid of this corporate sludge called systemd.

[Gusar]

You "Arch users", and I include myself loosely here, didn't have the balls, courage, or fotitude to stand up and "fork" Arch

This implies that

a) there was/is a need to fork Arch
b) that lack of balls, courage or fortitude are the only possible reasons for there not being a fork

Here's a thought - *you* spearhead an effort to fork it. You clearly believe there is a need, and it'd be a great display of your balls, courage and fortitude.