Microsoft ASP.NET vNext Is Open-Source, Runs On Linux

[jayrulez]

So you're telling me that Microsoft is going to use .NET and ASP.NET to provide the NSA with my "private" information?

[techzilla]

They deserve a small pinch of credit, ...cmon guys.

I'm no MS lover, Hell MS was the reason I first started using Linux a decade ago. Here is the deal though, IF this is what it appears to be, then it's a SMALL but positive move in the right direction. It also makes good business sense, from their perspective to play on all the server OS's. Now this is MS, so the old school strategies remain a legitimate concern.... but they have over the years made a shift towards increased openness and increased standardizations. They deserve at least some small props for those moves!

yes, that's not yet enough.... yes, they are still a proprietary software company.
but...They are getting CLOSER to the better of the proprietary bunch. To put it this way, if only considering openness, they are still below google but I'd say definitely above Oracle and Apple. They have been making SMALL, but still significant, changes for a good few years now. If I was seeing the old-school strategies, believe me i'd need a towel to wipe froth from my screaming mouth.... they have improved things a small bit.

Now the NSA things is a completely different matter, and it's also a two prong problem among ALL of the large IT corporations. The blame has fallen disproportionately away from the companies, they deserve to be smeared along with the government.... it's not the government acting alone, they had plenty of help and the corps should have acted in consumer interest instead of against consumer interest.

[DanLamb]

Phoronix: Microsoft ASP.NET vNext Is Open-Source, Runs On Linux

Microsoft announced .NET vNext and ASP.NET vNext at their TechEd North America conference today. ASP.NET vNext is the next-generation version of their server-side Web application framework and it's now cloud-oriented. Microsoft is supporting ASP.NET vNext under Linux via Mono...

http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTY4ODI

All the JVM web frameworks have been completely free and open source forever and are extremely Linux friendly, even Linux centric.

I've done full time ASP.NET work for years, and it's main attraction is to managers to reduce developer choice and support swapping out interchangeable developers.

Two picks for JVM web frameworks:

- Play Framework: https://github.com/playframework/playframework
- Jersey: jersey.java.net. Also check dropwizard.codahale.com for best practices.

Play does both web sites and web services, Jersey is only for web services.

If you really want to stick with Java, use Jersey, if you can use Scala, use Play. Play fully supports Java, and Jersey fully supports Scala, but I think Jersey is better for Java and Play is better for Scala.

[DanLamb]

I'm no MS lover, Hell MS was the reason I first started using Linux a decade ago. Here is the deal though, IF this is what it appears to be, then it's a SMALL but positive move in the right direction.

You can get much better dev tools, programming languages, IDEs, and web frameworks for free:

- JVM (Java, Scala, Clojure): All free, amazing IDEs, amazing web frameworks. Much better than .NET. Most stuff is completely free and open source and Linux friendly.
- Haskell. You want a better language? This is an excellent, stable, well developed choice that is very Linux and FOSS friendly.
- Agda/Idris: Two other bleeding edge free choices.

[Nth_man]

People like me are lured by "runs on Linux", and hoped something new was happening or coming in some way that not against the nature desire of businessman to make (more) money or to make competitor weak(er).

Finding truth is hard, and recognizing the distractions on the way is even harder.

Those are things to think about.

?All warfare is based on deception.?
-- Sun Tzu - "The Art of War"

[dee.]

Ah yes see I'm the shill here because I don't bow before the alter of "Everything Microsoft is Evil!!!" and instead make pragmatic choices based upon which technology is best.

When you buy products from a company with unethical practices, you are directly financially supporting those unethical practices.

There's nothing you've listed there that Apple and Google don't do, and in fact Google probably has a far closer relationship to the NSA due to again Google Analytics which provides far more useful information than Microsoft ever could.

Probably? Sure, nice speculation there. Google "could" "probably" give more sensible data to NSA. Is there proof they do so? Google is not innocent when it comes to respecting people's privacy, they have many horrible practices.

But to put things in perspective, Google does not willingly co-operate with NSA and only gives out information when forced to by law. Microsoft is in a willing relationship with NSA, willingly provides information about all exploits and vulnerabilities in all of their operating systems to NSA so that NSA agents can leverage and exploit these vulnerabilities to infiltrate people's computers. There is proof of this activity.

Furthermore, Google may have horrible privacy practices, but they balance it somewhat by doing some nice things for the FOSS community: SoC has been hugely beneficial for many FOSS projects, and Google has taken a stance against software patents, which is a lot more you can say for ms who is one of the biggest supporters of swpats. Yes, you might argue that Google's business model is such that it makes financial sense for them to oppose swpats, but that's just nitpicking. Results are what matters.

Meanwhile, ms literally attacks FOSS projects with swpats. They've been known to siphon their swpats out to patent trolls while making contracts that prevent them from litigating against ms but allowing litigation against others. They did that to some of the patents stolen from Nokia. Yes, I say stolen, because ms infiltrated Nokia with their mole Elop to bring the company down from the inside and butchered it.

You realize whether you're on social media or not doesn't stop the fact that they can and do use the video camera and microphone to record, the GPS to track location and create profiles and that any call you take or any text you send is associated with that profile, and any conversation that you have with someone who has a cellphone in the area is tracking you and listening to you. All social media does is give them *more* information

Oh now you're just going over to nutcase territory. NSA isn't omnipotent. Theoretically they could if they had the co-operation of the local phone operators, but seeing as I don't live in the USA, that's very unlikely to happen.

You're forgetting that you need Tor and to not use Google, Bing, or Ask as your search engine, instead use something like DuckDuckGo, and email has to be done using a provider that is not your ISP or one of the more popular free providers (Google, Microsoft, Yahoo)

I use Tor if I need to be sure of my privacy. I don't really bother to if I write some crap on a forum that'll be public anyway. But we were talking about ad networks. Ad networks and their tracking is easily blocked by browser extensions such as Ghostery. And for that matter, I do use DDG for most of my web searches.

That isn't the point though. The point is that you're trying to make it seem like the battle for privacy and rights is already lost, that there's nothing we can do about it, so you can justify your own inaction and passiveness. You pretend like it doesn't matter what you do, that we're already so fucked that nothing matters at all... but that's not the case. There's always a choice to fight and do whatever you can, there are always choices to make for encouraging more ethical practices. And already there is a large backlash against NSA and a movement against privacy invasion is growing. It's a bit of a clich?, but you can either be a part of the problem or a part of the solution...

With what exactly? Reaper drones fly at an altitude of 50,000 feet (~9 1/2 miles or ~ 15 km) in the real world unlike CoD you're not even going to see them let alone have anything that can touch them.

There are no reports of american drones ever violating Finnish airspace. If it happens, I'll start worrying about it then...

Actually the whole invasion of privacy has nothing to do with the corporations it has everything to do with a rogue government grabbing whatever power it can

Stop right there.

Do you think "government" exists in a vacuum? That it's just some big entity that came from somewhere and wants to rule us all because evil? Think again. Government is born from politics, and politics is born from the people. When business interests are allowed to be given a too large influence on politics, that creates bad government. This is a development in both US and global politics, and it's a very complex issue - simplifying it as a "rogue government powergrab" is just overly simplistic thinking and ignores the realities of global politics.

Corporate lobbyism, legislation that panders to corporate interests, bankers controlling the economy, banks that are "too big to fail", military-industrial complex that creates war and death as a business... it's all related closely together.

Using and supporting FOSS is one way we can push back against the rampant corporatism. Using/supporting microsoft is not...

About the middle of the pack in reality, Apple has done significantly worse like creating the whole concept of software patents in the first place. Intel is also significantly worse, Comcast is worse and so on.

Where are you getting your information from? Apple did not create the concept of swpats... they abuse them but they did not create them. Besides, ms abuses swpats just as much as Apple.

How is Intel worse? They support FOSS projects and provide open drivers for Linux.

[mike4]

Vala is a source-to-source programming language: it translates itself to C. With Vala you can write C#-like code with C-like performance.

Interesting, if I would start a new project, I might go with Vala instead of C#.

Microsoft wants us to prefer a reasonably solid language and decent framework over something that has been called a fractal of bad design.... The horror

Also Mono is staying open source and up to date, the main problem is that the packages have gotten out of date with the various distros due to miscommunication on Mono's part, due to what was marked as stable.

Yes, that's why most websites use PHP. Again probably I might not bother about C# until it's a open standard alike C++.

[Luke_Wolf]

When you buy products from a company with unethical practices, you are directly financially supporting those unethical practices.

Point to me one multi-billion dollar tech company that hasn't acted in an unethical manner or have unethical practices, not even IBM can be said to have a completely clean record.

Probably? Sure, nice speculation there. Google "could" "probably" give more sensible data to NSA. Is there proof they do so? Google is not innocent when it comes to respecting people's privacy, they have many horrible practices.

But to put things in perspective, Google does not willingly co-operate with NSA and only gives out information when forced to by law. Microsoft is in a willing relationship with NSA, willingly provides information about all exploits and vulnerabilities in all of their operating systems to NSA so that NSA agents can leverage and exploit these vulnerabilities to infiltrate people's computers. There is proof of this activity.

Furthermore, Google may have horrible privacy practices, but they balance it somewhat by doing some nice things for the FOSS community: SoC has been hugely beneficial for many FOSS projects, and Google has taken a stance against software patents, which is a lot more you can say for ms who is one of the biggest supporters of swpats. Yes, you might argue that Google's business model is such that it makes financial sense for them to oppose swpats, but that's just nitpicking. Results are what matters.

It's just as nice of speculation as your allegations against microsoft, fact is google was fingered by snowden as being a part of PRISM, you know that group of companies that the NSA basically outsourced it's online spying operations to.

Meanwhile, ms literally attacks FOSS projects with swpats. They've been known to siphon their swpats out to patent trolls while making contracts that prevent them from litigating against ms but allowing litigation against others. They did that to some of the patents stolen from Nokia. Yes, I say stolen, because ms infiltrated Nokia with their mole Elop to bring the company down from the inside and butchered it.

That's nice and all but I can't really say they're acting all that different from the rest of the multi-billion dollar tech giants

Oh now you're just going over to nutcase territory. NSA isn't omnipotent. Theoretically they could if they had the co-operation of the local phone operators, but seeing as I don't live in the USA, that's very unlikely to happen.

Ah yes because CarrierIQ totally didn't happen, and this totally hasn't been done in practice since the early 2000s when the FBI used it to take down one of the mobs. Also ESCHALON which effects all NATO nations totally didn't happen.

I use Tor if I need to be sure of my privacy. I don't really bother to if I write some crap on a forum that'll be public anyway. But we were talking about ad networks. Ad networks and their tracking is easily blocked by browser extensions such as Ghostery. And for that matter, I do use DDG for most of my web searches.

If you're using Gmail and friends they're also scanning your email, with Google being public about doing so. But at that point while they still have your phone as a bug, you're right in your internet information being mostly safe.

That isn't the point though. The point is that you're trying to make it seem like the battle for privacy and rights is already lost, that there's nothing we can do about it, so you can justify your own inaction and passiveness. You pretend like it doesn't matter what you do, that we're already so fucked that nothing matters at all... but that's not the case. There's always a choice to fight and do whatever you can, there are always choices to make for encouraging more ethical practices. And already there is a large backlash against NSA and a movement against privacy invasion is growing. It's a bit of a clich?, but you can either be a part of the problem or a part of the solution...

Oh yes because public outlash will obviously get them to stop, or oh wait that's not how this ever works. CARNIVORE got huge backlash during the early 2000s, and what did the FBI do? stop? no they renamed the system, same thing is going to happen here. They're going to continue spying, just under a different code name and possibly under a deeper level of secrecy. Also while there was definitely outlash when PRISM came to light your average citizen has gone back to not caring. The simple fact is without bloody revolution things aren't going to change, however we have a rogue government that can step on anyone who tries to resist which means that revolution is impossible and the system is well beyond the point where the changes required can be performed through the system.

There are no reports of american drones ever violating Finnish airspace. If it happens, I'll start worrying about it then...

So for all your nice words of shooting them down they were just that... words..

Stop right there.

Do you think "government" exists in a vacuum? That it's just some big entity that came from somewhere and wants to rule us all because evil? Think again. Government is born from politics, and politics is born from the people. When business interests are allowed to be given a too large influence on politics, that creates bad government. This is a development in both US and global politics, and it's a very complex issue - simplifying it as a "rogue government powergrab" is just overly simplistic thinking and ignores the realities of global politics.

I can assure you that business interests had nothing to do with how this all started in the 1950s, it had everything to do with the crusade against communism, which eventually grew and took on a life of it's own because spies never actually operate for their country they operate for themselves as power entities, and all power entities seek to expand their power.

Corporate lobbyism, legislation that panders to corporate interests, bankers controlling the economy, banks that are "too big to fail", military-industrial complex that creates war and death as a business... it's all related closely together.

That's nice but that really doesn't have anything to do with the business of spying on citizens, a lot of other tragedies of the system yes, but there's not really a reason as for why businesses would *want* the government spying on people, however nutjobs who feel it's their need to protect America from itself (aka the government as an entity), have all the reason in the world.

Using and supporting FOSS is one way we can push back against the rampant corporatism. Using/supporting microsoft is not...

Because Oracle/Sun Microsystems, Apple, and friends don't use FOSS and promote corporatism? Because Communist China, and Russia don't use FOSS and promote their own forms of corporatism and population slavery? Because the New York Stock Exchange don't use FOSS and obviously isn't the very embodiment of corporatism? Give me a break. FOSS has plenty of pragmatic reasons for it's superiority and why one should use it, but as a social movement it hasn't impeded corporatism one bit, and using it for the social movement is kinda stupid.

Where are you getting your information from? Apple did not create the concept of swpats... they abuse them but they did not create them. Besides, ms abuses swpats just as much as Apple.

Apple vs Franklin Computers along with Apple's various look and feel suits set the groundwork for most of the Intellectual Property laws about software in place today.

How is Intel worse? They support FOSS projects and provide open drivers for Linux.

Intel... a company that drove all of the competitors in the x86 market out of business through patent suites other than the ones it was legally obligated to allow due to their contracts with IBM. Intel... a company that intentionally crippled performance of AMD processors when using their compiler. Intel... a company that has been convicted multiple times of abusing it's monopoly position and setting up collusion. Intel... A company that joined with Microsoft at the hip (yes that company you hate so much) to the point where the term Wintel became a thing. Oh oh but it's all okay because they develop an open source driver and support some FOSS projects, that makes everything better unless your name is Microsoft, in which case you opensourcing anything or even doing anything at all absolutely must have some dark conspiracy behind it.

[directhex]

Again probably I might not bother about C# until it's a open standard alike C++.

C# has been an Open Standard (i.e. ECMA/ISO) for more than a decade.

[Luke_Wolf]

Yes, that's why most websites use PHP. Again probably I might not bother about C# until it's a open standard alike C++.

What part of C# being an ECMA standard, and the reference compiler being under Apache license and thus not only under a liberal open source license but with a total patent grant on the language itself do you not get? Or does it being from Microsoft somehow automatically mean that despite it being standardized and now openly developed that it can't be an open standard?

Also people use PHP because it's "easy" and because it's well known just as MySQL is through the whole LAMP (Linux, Apache, MySQL, PHP) stack, however if you ask the developer community their feelings on PHP, other than some bizarre outliers they're almost universal in their agreement that PHP is a horrible mess, and mostly as a result of people taking it well beyond what it's okay to be used for.

http://eev.ee/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/