Debian Now Voting On Init System Coupling

[prodigy_]

the disadvantages are mostly theoretical.

Disadvantages are always theoretical - until the point where your mission critical system crashes. You need to be very short-sighted to not see how the unnecessary complexity of systemd translates to real pain in the long run.

[frign]

Disadvantages are always theoretical - until the point where your mission critical system crashes. You need to be very short-sighted to not see how the unnecessary complexity of systemd translates to real pain in the long run.

Exactly, well said!
Some people just don't get it the first time.

[Gusar]

You need to be very short-sighted to not see how the unnecessary complexity of systemd translates to real pain in the long run.

That post lists some of what systemd does and then says "problem". That's a big leap, but no explanation how one leads to the other. So can you or frign elaborate on what pain is waiting for me?

[tuubi]

Disadvantages are always theoretical - until the point where your mission critical system crashes. You need to be very short-sighted to not see how the unnecessary complexity of systemd translates to real pain in the long run.

On the other hand, these risks do not become more imminent or less theoretical no matter how many fear-mongering articles a conservative minority produces (not talking about political parties here). Especially when most of the arguments boil down to a single programmer's abrasive personality. I'm glad Linux is doing well despite the rather infamously similar tendencies of it's benevolent dictator. It's not like either project as they stand today can be attributed solely to their original developers.

With regards to the necessity of what you call complexity, the rationale behind the design has been explained several times, and either you know it already or are intentionally ignoring it all. While controversy is understandable whenever changes are made to integral parts of a widely used system, in this case you'll just have to find a way to cope with holding a minority opinion. Don't you get tired of tilting at windmills? Because - believe it or not - yours is not a holy crusade against an all-consuming evil.

[gens]

On the other hand, these risks do not become more imminent or less theoretical no matter how many fear-mongering articles a conservative minority produces (not talking about political parties here). Especially when most of the arguments boil down to a single programmer's abrasive personality. I'm glad Linux is doing well despite the rather infamously similar tendencies of it's benevolent dictator. It's not like either project as they stand today can be attributed solely to their original developers.

With regards to the necessity of what you call complexity, the rationale behind the design has been explained several times, and either you know it already or are intentionally ignoring it all. While controversy is understandable whenever changes are made to integral parts of a widely used system, in this case you'll just have to find a way to cope with holding a minority opinion. Don't you get tired of tilting at windmills? Because - believe it or not - yours is not a holy crusade against an all-consuming evil.

you still did not answer me

[tuubi]

you still did not answer me

I don't have to, which is why I didn't even quote you. Your questions have been answered before. Learn to use google if you can't remember the answers, I'm not here to enable your laziness.

[eidolon]

Calling "clowns" people who prefer another init system? Come on!

Some people who preferred an option other than systemd were reasonable in their tones and analytical in their arguments, and they deserve credit for adding meaningful commentary to the discussion, but there was no shortage of trolling like "Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge", "Fsck SystemD and its developers and its users", etc idiotic bile either.

They just want to do cost savings, and don't want maintain all packaged for Upstart themselves, they rather have Debian maintain the packages and just get all that work for free.

Which, if taken at face value, would make for one reason why members of the CTTE employed by Canonical should have abstained from voting (agreed upon temporary alternate voters could have been appointed for the vote). That still would have left Ian to his temper tantrum though.

[Scimmia]

would you mind explaining why does it have to be pid 1 ?

Why does what have to be PID1? cgroup control?

[Skrapion]

Andreas just voted L A N FD, and I suspect Steve will also vote L first. This one may very well come down to a casting vote as well.

[Scimmia]

Na, remember, it's not just the first vote that counts. N has enough second and third place votes that it *should* take it, even with Steve putting L first.