Friction Building Around An Ubuntu Community Council Decision

[rohcQaH]

And I notice you completely ignored the fact that Wayland is well ahead of Mir on the mobile space, which you claimed was Mir's focus.

So true.

*picks up jolla phone*
*double taps the display*

Oh look, it's running wayland!

Jolla's phone was released in November 2013. Their SDK - including Wayland - was released in February 2013. That's one month before the announcement of Mir.



I do understand the reasons for server-side buffer allocations, but I've never been convinced that there's a technical argument for rewriting an incompatible stack instead of working within the wayland protocols.

[TheBlackCat]

I do understand the reasons for server-side buffer allocations, but I've never been convinced that there's a technical argument for rewriting an incompatible stack instead of working within the wayland protocols.

Since Wayland had working server-side buffer allocations before Mir was even started, it is clear there isn't one.

[oleid]

Since Wayland had working server-side buffer allocations before Mir was even started, it is clear there isn't one.

Technically, Wayland doesn't require either client-side or server-side allocations. It's the compositor which handles that detail. It would have been enough to implement Mir as Wayland compositor and everyone would have been happy.

[Iksf]

I have no interest in whether making Mir is a good idea, its their choice, whatever. However Riddel has always come across as a great guy and I cannot blame Kubuntu for being pissed off from recent developments in Ubuntu. I wish Kubuntu would just wander off from the Ubuntu brand and become what Ubuntu was initially developed towards, Debian made easy and usable, with KDE ofc. I'm not sure how possible this would be but I wish it would happen. Ubuntu is clearly going places Kubuntu can't and shouldn't attempt to follow so perhaps they should separate.

[wodencafe]

It is sad that a discussion about the CC's mistreatment of Jon Riddell has devolved into a Mir vs Wayland flame war.

As a longtime user of both Ubuntu and Kubuntu (8 years now), I have watched both of the communities grow and expand over time, and all I see is a political trumping attempt by Canonical to further separate themselves from Kubuntu. It should be clear from anyone reading the IRC logs that Riddell wants what is best for the community, and was stonewalled, and is now being made an example of.

I love Kubuntu, it is great, I personally find KDE much easier to use than popular alternatives. The Kubuntu team have provided quality releases and I have been satisfied with their work. If Kubuntu decided to give Ubuntu the finger and rebase on something else, I would still use Kubuntu.

[chrisb]

JRiddell asks an interesting question about the licensing of Ubuntu binaries, but he should consider that his interpretation of copyright law might be incorrect. He insists that the person who compiles a package has no copyrights over it, and yet copyright law says that the person who compiles source code does indeed become one of the copyright holders of the resulting binary. The transitive nature of the GPL means that distribution of the binary confers the right to re-distribute the binary, but other license do not grant this freedom. A person compiling BSD/non-copyleft licensed binaries can even release them as closed source.

It appears JRiddell has had some animosity towards Ubuntu for a while e.g. the thread "request for some pizzas" where he posts a public request for immediate money "to be productive", and in the process takes swipes at the Canonical community team, their secret decisions, and "very dodgy accounting practices" etc. Personally, if I were in charge of Canonical/Ubuntu I would have had him removed from the team after reading:

If the funding from October 2012 really isn't included in the current community fund and it simply has been stolen by Canonical this is worse than I had thought.

That is just unprofessional. What company would accept a disgruntled ex-employee publicly defaming them on a community mailing list with accusations of stealing donations?

[CTown]

Jon Riddle is an extremely active member of the whole Desktop Linux community. As part of his work on Kubuntu, he represents a decent size of the Ubuntu community. Being so active in KDE (for instance, he is the current release coordinator of Plasma) he works with members of multiple distros. Not only that but he organizes sprints to keep moral up while getting serious work done. JRiddle is much more meta than either Ubuntu or Kubuntu. So, I get what and why John Riddle is butting heads with the Ubuntu Community Council (CC) but he really should understand that Canonical's behavior is beyond the scope of the CC (whether Canonical has done anything wrong or not).

[k1l_]

JRiddell asks an interesting question about the licensing of Ubuntu binaries, but he should consider that his interpretation of copyright law might be incorrect. He insists that the person who compiles a package has no copyrights over it, and yet copyright law says that the person who compiles source code does indeed become one of the copyright holders of the resulting binary. The transitive nature of the GPL means that distribution of the binary confers the right to re-distribute the binary, but other license do not grant this freedom. A person compiling BSD/non-copyleft licensed binaries can even release them as closed source.

It appears JRiddell has had some animosity towards Ubuntu for a while e.g. the thread "request for some pizzas" where he posts a public request for immediate money "to be productive", and in the process takes swipes at the Canonical community team, their secret decisions, and "very dodgy accounting practices" etc. Personally, if I were in charge of Canonical/Ubuntu I would have had him removed from the team after reading:



That is just unprofessional. What company would accept a disgruntled ex-employee publicly defaming them on a community mailing list with accusations of stealing donations?

while at the same time the kubuntu team or kde/kubuntu individuals get a lot of the funding money:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1f2BYK6cVWT3yH295TbJXt8J5VGzL4vcSRVXFYL204U0/edit

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1NkXhrylqgXkMOc1_77p58jj8ZCfeC58dnIDcUNp8BpA/edit

this is even more ridicolous knowing that facts.

so its getting more and more to: kubuntu just wants the canonical money and infrastructure but badmouths them every time they can. that is a shame for the kde community. dont think that works with their CoC.

[oleid]

while at the same time the kubuntu team or kde/kubuntu individuals get a lot of the funding money:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1f2BYK6cVWT3yH295TbJXt8J5VGzL4vcSRVXFYL204U0/edit

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1NkXhrylqgXkMOc1_77p58jj8ZCfeC58dnIDcUNp8BpA/edit

this is even more ridicolous knowing that facts.

so its getting more and more to: kubuntu just wants the canonical money and infrastructure but badmouths them every time they can. that is a shame for the kde community. dont think that works with their CoC.

If you had read the "request for some pizzas" thread, you'd know that it's not about not getting any money, but about the the procedure for applying for money. And it's about the money, that got collected since October 2012. The founding reports start in April 2014 (http://community.ubuntu.com/help-inf...nding/reports/).

[k1l_]

If you had read the "request for some pizzas" thread, you'd know that it's not about not getting any money, but about the the procedure for applying for money. And it's about the money, that got collected since October 2012. The founding reports start in April 2014 (http://community.ubuntu.com/help-inf...nding/reports/).

in https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ub...ay/000513.html jono bacon states that " the bar is pretty low...unless someone wants money that won't benefit the wider Ubuntu (inc. flavors) project, or wants money for their own personal benefit, most things got (and I presume still do get) funded."
the "request for pizzas" sounds more like: "why is canonical not giving me any money? why do i have to ask for it" its just another point where i dont see the "lovely victim" that some people want to make him look like. the bullying of the CC was just the last straw to break the camels back.
the KDE people are proud of their CoC when they can point other to it. but Riddel is showing us what its worth.

the funding from that time has been reported now, too: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ub...ay/000555.html
reading the messages from the kubuntu people one can interpret that as "canonical is stealing our money". which is not only false, its a real heavy accusation. looking at what the funds get used for (kde meetings, individuals from kubuntu,...) its even more ridiculous.