USB Type-C Improvements On The Way To The Linux 4.17 Kernel

[mateMat]

Thanks for your comment edwaleni !
I understand it is a very old comment, but as a simple user, what should I expect if I plug a daugther board into a PCIe connector. Will it work under an Ubuntu based OS?
Thank you for bringing clarity to this.
Best

[edwaleni]

Asmedia ASM3142 supports USB3.1 Gen 2.

Supported in all mainstream Linux kernels (per Asmedia)

No publicly available silicon for USB 3.2 yet.

Asmedia ASM2142 had some limitations due to the number PCIe lanes and the PCIe v2 spec. ASM3142 uses PCIe v3 spec.

ASM3142 supports (2) full 10Gbps ports, whereas ASM2142 had to split 3.1 lane bandwidth.

[Sniperfox47]

The confusion is that not every port delivers or accepts everything. And it's not visible.

Eg. A laptop has five Type-C ports.

1. Can only do charging.
2. Does USB 1.x/2.x in host mode.
3. Does USB 1.x/2.x/3.x host + Altmodes: HDMI/DP out and HDMI in not TB or Ethernet.
4. Does USB 1.x/2.x/3.x host and guest + Altmodes: TB or Ethernet not HDMI/DP.
5. Does Analog audio.

Now how can we tell the user that in a way that's obvious and consistent across vendors?

Don't get me wrong I'm all for Type-C. On port, one cable to rule them all. But advertising port capabilities is something that needs work

Oh and let's have a wall outlet with Type-C which provides Power and USB hooked providing Ethernet and Audio out guest Devices.

Happy plugging.

You mean like this...?

https://www.alogic.co/pub/media/wysi...Full_chart.png

To the best of my knowledge, Apple is the only one who doesn't. (On laptops)

[altarius]

The confusion is that not every port delivers or accepts everything. And it's not visible.

Eg. A laptop has five Type-C ports.

1. Can only do charging.
2. Does USB 1.x/2.x in host mode.
3. Does USB 1.x/2.x/3.x host + Altmodes: HDMI/DP out and HDMI in not TB or Ethernet.
4. Does USB 1.x/2.x/3.x host and guest + Altmodes: TB or Ethernet not HDMI/DP.
5. Does Analog audio.

at least the TB ones (and to my knowledge the most commonly used ones in notebooks) are marked with a ... thunderbolt.

looking at my notebook, i do have 2 TB type C marked with the aforementioned thunderbolt and a standard type A with a "SS*high voltage sign*" - indicating usb 3.0 with additonal charging support.

[Falcon1]

People basically just need to know that USB Type-C is compatible with older USB but better in every way.

The confusion is that not every port delivers or accepts everything. And it's not visible.

Eg. A laptop has five Type-C ports.

1. Can only do charging.
2. Does USB 1.x/2.x in host mode.
3. Does USB 1.x/2.x/3.x host + Altmodes: HDMI/DP out and HDMI in not TB or Ethernet.
4. Does USB 1.x/2.x/3.x host and guest + Altmodes: TB or Ethernet not HDMI/DP.
5. Does Analog audio.

Now how can we tell the user that in a way that's obvious and consistent across vendors?

Don't get me wrong I'm all for Type-C. On port, one cable to rule them all. But advertising port capabilities is something that needs work

Oh and let's have a wall outlet with Type-C which provides Power and USB hooked providing Ethernet and Audio out guest Devices.

Happy plugging.

[wagaf]

"Massive?". I am familiar with alt-modes. and muxing onto the Type C port. That is why I said less than "full" specification.

Why show a Type C is only under Gen1 or 2 when the USB spec says otherwise? Hence the graphic above.

The point beyond my original Linux support request is that while the standards are published, in the market is confusion.

People basically just need to know that USB Type-C is compatible with older USB but better in every way.

Most people simply know USB Type-C as "the new universal charger port" (which it is).

More advanced users will have to learn that there are differences between cables, in charging speed an.d data transfer speed, and that devices can use different protocols over USB such as displayport.

Agree that there may be some indicator for these characteristics on Type-C cables and ports. But that might add even more confusion for users.

Every Type-C cable should be required to be able to transfer at least 5Gbps, which some devices now require.

[edwaleni]

You have a massive misunderstanding of the USB Type-C spec. Alt-modes including DisplayPort, GbE, Power Delivery, and others are an *optional* part of the spec, for both controllers and ports themselves.

There's specifically USB-C muxes and multiplexers designed to combine alt-modes and USB data lines on one Type-C port, and this is totally allowed under the USB spec.

The specs are fully available for free here if you want to read through them: http://www.usb.org/developers/docs/

Under the Type-C spec it even explocitly calls out that Type-C is simply a connector spec, which is decoupled from any specific USB data spec, and those in turn are decoupled from any Alt-mode.

None of 3.1gen1, 3.1gen2, or 3.2 imply DisplayPort Alt-mode, or any other Alt-mode.

"Massive?". I am familiar with alt-modes. and muxing onto the Type C port. That is why I said less than "full" specification.

Why show a Type C is only under Gen1 or 2 when the USB spec says otherwise? Hence the graphic above.

The point beyond my original Linux support request is that while the standards are published, in the market is confusion.

[Sniperfox47]

All, if not most Type A ports are color coded. Blue has been the USB3.x method. Type C have not been color coded between 3.x, 3.1 Gen1 or Gen2. I think i have seen 1 Type C cable that actually said "3.1" on it.

The "sin" has been laptop makers wiring up a Type C port to a USB 3.x/Gen1 controller which was never ratified by the USB standards board. People will think they will get Gen2/10Gbps rates, when Gen 1 (5Gbps) is the real rate.

I am going through the approved adapter list at USB.ORG to see if they have any certified for "full" Gen1/2 or 3.2 use. For those who ask, "full" USB 3.1 should be able to pass video or GbE via virtual interfaces in the OS. Most of the adapters outside of Apple can not do this without a dongle of some sort.

Then see which ones have explicit Linux support.

You have a massive misunderstanding of the USB Type-C spec. Alt-modes including DisplayPort, GbE, Power Delivery, and others are an *optional* part of the spec, for both controllers and ports themselves.

There's specifically USB-C muxes and multiplexers designed to combine alt-modes and USB data lines on one Type-C port, and this is totally allowed under the USB spec.

The specs are fully available for free here if you want to read through them: http://www.usb.org/developers/docs/

Under the Type-C spec it even explocitly calls out that Type-C is simply a connector spec, which is decoupled from any specific USB data spec, and those in turn are decoupled from any Alt-mode.

None of 3.1gen1, 3.1gen2, or 3.2 imply DisplayPort Alt-mode, or any other Alt-mode.

[PuckPoltergeist]

USB 1.0: 1996
Thunderbolt 1: 2011

[edwaleni]

You mean kinda like how Type-A can be 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, 3.0, 3.1gen1 or 3.1gen2? :P

Or do you mean that its not color coded? Because Asus gaming laptops definitely have both 3.0 and 2.0 type-A ports that are red coloured. :P

All, if not most Type A ports are color coded. Blue has been the USB3.x method. Type C have not been color coded between 3.x, 3.1 Gen1 or Gen2. I think i have seen 1 Type C cable that actually said "3.1" on it.

The "sin" has been laptop makers wiring up a Type C port to a USB 3.x/Gen1 controller which was never ratified by the USB standards board. People will think they will get Gen2/10Gbps rates, when Gen 1 (5Gbps) is the real rate.

I am going through the approved adapter list at USB.ORG to see if they have any certified for "full" Gen1/2 or 3.2 use. For those who ask, "full" USB 3.1 should be able to pass video or GbE via virtual interfaces in the OS. Most of the adapters outside of Apple can not do this without a dongle of some sort.

Then see which ones have explicit Linux support.