Rust-Written Rustls Now Reportedly Outperforming OpenSSL & BoringSSL

[Weasel]

Dude, your analogy implied a physical constraint, something people can't physically do due to laws of physics (unless you find out how and enlighten us?)

[ssokolow]

If it's something everyone could do with willpower, then yeah. I don't think that's the case though.

Thank you for finally properly describing writing correct C++ as part of a team of N humans where N>1.

[Weasel]

Y'know, sooner or later you wind up with this:

Everyone: We can't walk on water
Jesus: LOL. Skill issue.

If it's something everyone could do with willpower, then yeah. I don't think that's the case though.

[ssokolow]

Yeah. Either that, or their C++ code is just hot garbage (and old), like Mozilla's. Can't say without looking at their code.

Y'know, sooner or later you wind up with this:

Everyone: We can't walk on water
Jesus: LOL. Skill issue.

[Weasel]

Rust developers at Google are twice as productive as C++ teams:

https://www.theregister.com/2024/03/31/rust_google_c/

Is this a skill issue?

Yeah. Either that, or their C++ code is just hot garbage (and old), like Mozilla's. Can't say without looking at their code.

[darkonix]

I mean yeah, Rust will likely bring down the bug rate, since most devs suck. But it's pure skill issue though. That is a fact.

Good thing the economy is going worse these days so those subpar noobs get laid off and only the quality ones remain. (nothing to do with programming language mind you, but the skill level of the dev itself)

Rust developers at Google are twice as productive as C++ teams:

https://www.theregister.com/2024/03/31/rust_google_c/

Is this a skill issue?

[mobadboy]

Rust was developed at Mozilla. I'd be surprised if they weren't the first ones using it.



No, I said that, if anyone has the budget and impetus to hire or train good C++ coders (assuming such people exist in the context of large codebases developed by teams of people in the real world), it'd be at least one of those three companies. Thus, the fact that all three of them are using Rust and failed to get their memory-safety CVEs down without it suggests that it's not feasible to hire or train such people.



We shall see. I still think anyone who is too manly to wear a seatbelt is a fool.

why argue with that person any longer?

waste of keystrokes

sucks to suck, as they say

[ssokolow]

Since they were one of the first ones to switch from C++ to Rust? So their reasoning is irrelevant.

Rust was developed at Mozilla. I'd be surprised if they weren't the first ones using it.

...and who said those devs are quality? Hard to say for Microsoft or Apple, since they're mostly closed source, but I know people who saw Windows source code (either by working there or due to those infamous leaks) say it's a clusterfuck disaster, or something along those lines. There's your clue.

For Apple, you know there was the infamous "goto fail" security bug in iOS that didn't apply to the if because of no brace? That's enough to tell you the skill level of their C programmers. How the fuck did such shit pass review in the first place?

What else do you want? You link to logical fallacies (no true scotsman) but you're literally doing argument from authority because clearly you don't even bother to think if they have good coders or not (they likely don't).

No, I said that, if anyone has the budget and impetus to hire or train good C++ coders (assuming such people exist in the context of large codebases developed by teams of people in the real world), it'd be at least one of those three companies. Thus, the fact that all three of them are using Rust and failed to get their memory-safety CVEs down without it suggests that it's not feasible to hire or train such people.

I mean yeah, Rust will likely bring down the bug rate, since most devs suck. But it's pure skill issue though. That is a fact.

Good thing the economy is going worse these days so those subpar noobs get laid off and only the quality ones remain. (nothing to do with programming language mind you, but the skill level of the dev itself)

We shall see. I still think anyone who is too manly to wear a seatbelt is a fool.

[Weasel]

OK, fine. I'll bite again. Ahem...

Don't try to change the subject. When did I ever say anything about Mozilla's code?

Since they were one of the first ones to switch from C++ to Rust? So their reasoning is irrelevant.

If I'm referring to anyone, I'm talking about how Microsoft, Google, and Apple (all companies who have the budget and the incentive to hire or train skilled programmers) have all started incorporating Rust into their projects, and started producing articles like this: https://security.googleblog.com/2022...ndroid-13.html

...and who said those devs are quality? Hard to say for Microsoft or Apple, since they're mostly closed source, but I know people who saw Windows source code (either by working there or due to those infamous leaks) say it's a clusterfuck disaster, or something along those lines. There's your clue.

For Apple, you know there was the infamous "goto fail" security bug in iOS that didn't apply to the if because of no brace? That's enough to tell you the skill level of their C programmers. How the fuck did such shit pass review in the first place?

What else do you want? You link to logical fallacies (no true scotsman) but you're literally doing argument from authority because clearly you don't even bother to think if they have good coders or not (they likely don't).

...and, again, I'm not talking about your ability to use C++ to write a new TempleOS. I'm talking about what can bring down the bug rate in real-world situations where you're not in charge of who you have to share a codebase with.

Ok that's completely different than the original topic isn't it?

I mean yeah, Rust will likely bring down the bug rate, since most devs suck. But it's pure skill issue though. That is a fact.

Good thing the economy is going worse these days so those subpar noobs get laid off and only the quality ones remain. (nothing to do with programming language mind you, but the skill level of the dev itself)

[ssokolow]

Spoken like a true theory crafted who I'm sure hasn't worked with Mozilla's code for even 1 hour.

Spare me your idealistic fantasies and keep coping to defend their decision (for Rust).

OK, fine. I'll bite again. Ahem...

Don't try to change the subject. When did I ever say anything about Mozilla's code?

If I'm referring to anyone, I'm talking about how Microsoft, Google, and Apple (all companies who have the budget and the incentive to hire or train skilled programmers) have all started incorporating Rust into their projects, and started producing articles like this: https://security.googleblog.com/2022...ndroid-13.html

...and, again, I'm not talking about your ability to use C++ to write a new TempleOS. I'm talking about what can bring down the bug rate in real-world situations where you're not in charge of who you have to share a codebase with.