Linux 4.19 Raises The GCC Minimum Version Required To Build The Kernel

[duby229]

Yes.

GNU/Linux is the proper name for what many people simply call "Linux". Some people want to exclude GNU from the name and reduce the general perception of relevance of GNU in the GNU/Linux operating system. For them, having the ability to compile the kernel without the GNU Compiler Collection (GCC), would make excluding GNU an easier task.

There are other benefits to other groups too, but that's one obvious one that comes to mind.

That's soooo narrow minded it's actually stupid. Lets just call our favorite OS, GNU/X11/Gnome/Firefox/Linux.... Geez.... You want recognition for GNU and everybody else wants recognition for themse;ves. So why stop there, X11 is just as important to end users as GNU is, so is Gnome or KDE, if GNU must be included in the name string then those -must- be as well.. And you aint getting online without a browser, might as well throw that in the name too. Media player is also important as well, why ain't that in the name string.... Morons....

[duby229]

I didn't say or even suggest that there were or could be plotting kernel devs. I just pointed out that some people dislike referring to the system by its proper name and seemingly enjoy promoting it as just 'Linux'. Some of those people would benefit from a kernel that can be compiled without GCC. They'd have an easier job of promoting the OS using their preferred term. That could serve as motivation for an individual to work on, use or otherwise support such an effort. No group plot is needed.

Also: a conspiracy implies something bad or illegal is being done. I didn't say that removing 'GNU' from the name would be bad. I think people who say that GNU/Linux is just 'Linux' are factually incorrect. I don't think they are bad and they are certainly not criminals.

The real truth is that -you- are factually incorrect. You want to call it GNU/Linux, except they are only two of the major contributing components and GNU components aren't even the most critical ones.... If you want to include GNU in the name string then you better start putting the rest of the system components in that name string as well. But you won't of course.....

[Weasel]

faster compile times are always beneficial

No they're not, mostly for kernel developers or people compiling tons of kernels. And also when developing you don't usually turn on all optimizations so compile time is marginal at best, and you don't "compile from scratch" all the time.

[cj.wijtmans]

That's soooo narrow minded it's actually stupid. Lets just call our favorite OS, GNU/X11/Gnome/Firefox/Linux.... Geez.... You want recognition for GNU and everybody else wants recognition for themse;ves. So why stop there, X11 is just as important to end users as GNU is, so is Gnome or KDE, if GNU must be included in the name string then those -must- be as well.. And you aint getting online without a browser, might as well throw that in the name too. Media player is also important as well, why ain't that in the name string.... Morons....

nonsense argument. GNU/Linux is a full operating system. has nothing to dowith x11 or other software.

[Grinch]

● Consistent toolchain for kernel and userspace
● Better static analysis + dynamic analysis (sanitizers)
● Additional compiler warning flag coverage
● More tools planned in the future (control-flow analysis, LTO, PGO)
● Shake out undefined behaviors
● Improve both code bases

Looking at that list:

Not sure what consistent toolchain means in this context.
Are there any sanitizers available in Clang/LLVM that are not available in GCC these days ?
GCC has LTO and PGO, not sure what this 'control-flow analysis' tool is.

As for the other points I fully agree, being able to compile Linux with more than one compiler toolchain is a 'good thing' and will likely shake out more bugs. As stated, the project seem to have stalled, as I recall the major blocker is that of VLA's (variable length arrays in structures) which the Linux developers makes use of.

This is a compiler extension which Clang devs refuses to add, and the Linux kernel devs refuse to abandon.

[duby229]

nonsense argument. GNU/Linux is a full operating system. has nothing to dowith x11 or other software.

If you're a desktop user then it has everything to do with x11 and your desktop of choice. I'm certain almost everyone here uses a graphical display of some kind.

[cybertraveler]

nonsense argument. GNU/Linux is a full operating system. has nothing to dowith x11 or other software.

Duby is an angry toll. I just put him on my ignore list. He often hurls insults at people, speaks with an aggressive tone and offers poorly reasoned arguments.

Personally, I don't even care what the system is called; I just called it GNU/Linux because the system needs a name and GNU/Linux is factually accurate. It started as the GNU project to make a fully free operating system. Later Linux was created and GNU software was widely combined with the Linux kernel to produce the hugely successful GNU/Linux OS that we use today. People use and distribute GNU/Linux in many different permutations these days; sometimes without X11, a browser and a media player.

I don't like referring to the system as just 'Linux', because it's confusing on many levels.

1) Linux is just a kernel. I know some people (including Linus himself IIRC) call the kernel an "operating system", but that makes no sense to me. You can't do anything practical as a user with just the kernel. However with the GNU userland, the GNU compiler and the kernel combined you can make a usable operating system. GNU even includes Gnome. If you use Gnome with it's Wayland compositor you can even have a graphical desktop environment complete with a web browser using only GNU and Linux. Though: maybe you would also need Mesa. I don't know. That's just 1 extra thing though.

2) The Linux kernel is used in other operating systems which bare very little resemblance to GNU/Linux distributions. e.g. Android. It's unlikely that a piece of software written for use on GNU/Linux will work on Android (which uses Linux) without adding special compatibility software to Android to make it work.

[duby229]

Duby is an angry toll. I just put him on my ignore list. He often hurls insults at people, speaks with an aggressive tone and offers poorly reasoned arguments.

Personally, I don't even care what the system is called; I just called it GNU/Linux because the system needs a name and GNU/Linux is factually accurate. It started as the GNU project to make a fully free operating system. Later Linux was created and GNU software was widely combined with the Linux kernel to produce the hugely successful GNU/Linux OS that we use today. People use and distribute GNU/Linux in many different permutations these days; sometimes without X11, a browser and a media player.

I don't like referring to the system as just 'Linux', because it's confusing on many levels.

1) Linux is just a kernel. I know some people (including Linus himself IIRC) call the kernel an "operating system", but that makes no sense to me. You can't do anything practical as a user with just the kernel. However with the GNU userland, the GNU compiler and the kernel combined you can make a usable operating system. GNU even includes Gnome. If you use Gnome with it's Wayland compositor you can even have a graphical desktop environment complete with a web browser using only GNU and Linux. Though: maybe you would also need Mesa. I don't know. That's just 1 extra thing though.

2) The Linux kernel is used in other operating systems which bare very little resemblance to GNU/Linux distributions. e.g. Android. It's unlikely that a piece of software written for use on GNU/Linux will work on Android (which uses Linux) without adding special compatibility software to Android to make it work.

That's an oversimplification beyond belief. There are plenty of other toolchains in use right now. The GNU tools are fairly complete collection that a lot of people like and that's the reason why it get's used, but it damn sure isn't the only toolchain that get's used on a desktop linux. It isn't even possible to make a desktop linux with just the GNU tools, but it is for damn sure possible to make one without them...

[linuxjacques]

In addition to minimum GCC version, I wish the kernel docs would list maximum GCC version.

[duby229]

In addition to minimum GCC version, I wish the kernel docs would list maximum GCC version.

Huh? The maximum version will always be the git branch. Think about it, there is no maximum, gcc is constantly being developed and at any moment of time the newest version is the git tree.