System76 Bringing Out "Pangolin" As An AMD Renoir Linux Laptop

[dylanmtaylor]

Would really like to support them but can't justify shelling out Thinkpad money for a Clevo rebrand with no support locally.

yeah, their laptop quality and support is definitely worse than a tier-1 manufacturer like Dell or Lenovo.

[sarmad]

They can say what they want, the hardware doesn't lie...

gazelle ~ # lspci -v | grep CLEVO
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer Xeon E3-1200 v6/7th Gen Core Processor Host Bridge/DRAM Registers
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer HD Graphics 630
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family USB 3.0 xHCI Controller
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family Thermal Subsystem
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer HM170/QM170 Chipset SATA Controller [AHCI Mode]
Capabilities: [90] Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family PCI Express Root Port
Capabilities: [90] Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family PCI Express Root Port
Capabilities: [90] Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family PCI Express Root Port
Capabilities: [90] Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family PCI Express Root Port
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer HM175 Chipset LPC/eSPI Controller
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family Power Management Controller
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer CM238 HD Audio Controller
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family SMBus
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer RTL8411B PCI Express Card Reader
Subsystem: CLEVO/KAPOK Computer RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller

You can get the Clevo for cheaper if you want, but you won't be getting the open source firmware nor the disabled ME with that, and you also won't get the same level of support. You also won't be getting the nice on-boarding experience of the preinstalled PopOS. You can get the Clevo and do some of these extra stuff yourself to save the extra tax, but then there are plenty of things in life that you can do yourself instead of paying someone to do it for you; it's all about how much you value your own time.

That said, I have a Darter Pro and I do agree that the build quality of the Clevos is cheap (that keyboard flex is annoying for sure). I wish they find a better supplier even if it means a bit extra cost; I don't mind paying a little more for some improved build quality.

[stormcrow]

Not the first System76 AMD laptop, Michael. The Serval WS was the first. Pangolin is just the first with both AMD CPU and GPU. Serval has an AMD CPU and Nvidia GPU. It may be arguable how cumbersome a 6 lb laptop is, but it's still a laptop and still fits in most laptop bags.

some_canuck Well then this product isn't for you, is it. Standard UEFI is full of security bugs and holes (not that Linux isn't), but at least the Linux kernel, SeaBIOS, and other Coreboot payloads can be audited. Since UEFI is BSD licensed no vendor UEFI implementation is open for scrutiny.

[moriel5]

They said they were going to build their own systems from scratch, still waiting... (okay, maybe they made the mobo to the thelio, but why would i buy a desktop when i can build one myself with a gigabyte/asus motherboard)

edit: and coreboot means nothing to me, why would i boot a linux kernel to boot my linux kernel... standard efi works just fine.

Coreboot does not contain a Linux kernel, you're confusing it with LinuxBoot, and most UEFI implementations are extremely buggy and outdated due to the vendors attempting to twist the EFI to their own liking, which means limited support, so no, standard EFI does not work (properly).
Coreboot is the gold-standard for how a UEFI should behave, which is why a Coreboot-equipped PC works so well and boots up so quickly.

Even Microsoft has switched over to Coreboot for these reasons, just adding a proper GUI to it via Project MU.

That said, I wonder whether it would be possible to flash a Clevo to it's System76 rebranded counterpart, since that would be absolutely awesome (warning, if possible, this would necessitate a hardware flash with an external programmer, such as the CH341a).

[moriel5]

Not the first System76 AMD laptop, Michael. The Serval WS was the first. Pangolin is just the first with both AMD CPU and GPU. Serval has an AMD CPU and Nvidia GPU. It may be arguable how cumbersome a 6 lb laptop is, but it's still a laptop and still fits in most laptop bags.

some_canuck Well then this product isn't for you, is it. Standard UEFI is full of security bugs and holes (not that Linux isn't), but at least the Linux kernel, SeaBIOS, and other Coreboot payloads can be audited. Since UEFI is BSD licensed no vendor UEFI implementation is open for scrutiny.

The Serval WS has a desktop APU, so it does not fit within the same category, it belongs in the exotic laptop market.
And Linux is a possible payload for Coreboot, however it is not part of it by default.

[moriel5]

Would really like to support them but can't justify shelling out Thinkpad money for a Clevo rebrand with no support locally.

Funnily enough, a similarly specced ThinkPad L15 will be over the equivalent of $1000 in my country, and Lenovo has cut quite a few corners with the AMD variants (by the way, the Intel variants are even more expensive here), including not respecting their own Linux support for all Think products-no exception promise.

[moriel5]

They said they were going to build their own systems from scratch, still waiting... (okay, maybe they made the mobo to the thelio, but why would i buy a desktop when i can build one myself with a gigabyte/asus motherboard)

edit: and coreboot means nothing to me, why would i boot a linux kernel to boot my linux kernel... standard efi works just fine.

By the way, System76 did not manufacture the motherboard (that was provided by Gigabyte), they had manufactured the case, and developed the daughterboard.
They already have already built their factory, however it is still in it's infancy, so it is only suited for making things such as it's case.

System76 is still researching how to build their own hardware.

[nkalkhof]

A similar SKU is available for EU buyers here:

[Alexmitter]

edit: and coreboot means nothing to me, why would i boot a linux kernel to boot my linux kernel... standard efi works just fine.

LOL, do you seriously believe coreboot is a linux kernel?

[cen1]

How many external monitors could I hook up? Looks like 1 or max 2 if that usb-C is a DP also. But no info on the page, really a shame.

Still waiting for an AMD laptop with 3x external.