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Android-x86 Is Still Working Towards Its 9.0 "Pie" Release

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  • #21
    Originally posted by starshipeleven View Post
    This is true for OEMs too, but the main point here is that having a new phone every 6 months is the only way to get money in a saturated market if your businness model is based on hardware sales and not on services.

    If we are going to demonize that, everything not a service and in a saturated market is evil too.
    It's the iPhone effect. Yearly to biennial releases were once common in the electronics market and those releases were sufficient. Once Apple demonstrated that they could get away with biyearly releases, everyone else followed in tandem. The only problem is that Apple, like Google, also gets a major cut from their app store so they get their money from both ways (shouldn't that be illegal based on monopoly laws). Samsung and everyone else has to sell their stuff so high just to cover the costs of releasing so many phones. It's consumer psychology -- if Apple releases new stuff on a schedule, we need to release our stuff on a schedule so we look just as innovative and fresh and trendy .

    IMHO, Qualcomm and the other manufacturers that don't release updated chipset drivers are also to blame. They realized that iPhone keeping up with the Jones' trend so they sell their hardware with short shelf life so everyone has to keep buying new hardware to keep up and can't rely on sales based on services even if they wanted to.

    I'd be happy paying LG or Motorola or even the Deathstar AT&T some money if it meant I'd get OS updates on my phone. The problem with that is LG or Motorola can't consider offering me that service because the chipset manufacturers don't release updated drivers. How can they offer a service if they can't guarantee it will be around for more than two or three years at best?

    I don't know what the solution for that is outside of legislation forcing 5 years or more of software updates to come from hardware manufacturers once they release their product...and I imagine we'll just see assloads of business start up and go bankrupt every few years as a loophole to get around that form of legislation.
    Last edited by skeevy420; 01-23-2020, 04:00 PM.

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    • #22
      Originally posted by skeevy420 View Post
      It's the iPhone effect.
      I'd say blaming Apple is bs, even if I wouldn't mind shitting on them.

      The same trend towards planned obsolescence has been growing in all consumer hardware, home appliances and so on. It does not take a businness genius to understand basic concepts like that if your market saturates the sales go down dramatically, and the only way to deal with that and not die horribly is taking control of the device lifecycle and decide how long it will last when you are at the design stage.


      I don't know what the solution for that is outside of legislation forcing 5 years or more of software updates to come from hardware manufacturers once they release their product.
      Assuming they do something serious about that, it's going to hurt a lot of companies bottom line, so you will only kill off the smaller players that are very barely profitable now, and we will be left with like Samsung and Google and Apple still making smartphones.

      If it is bad enough (i.e. enough companies stop buying mobile hardware to make smartphones) you could also trigger a collapse in mobile hardware development, and this can cascade on ARM too so you might get less decent high-performance designs for servers and high-performance applications.
      And I'm sure there are more things connected to the scene that I'm ignoring.

      Really this is a very complex economical thing and pulling away a leg of the structure will have cascade effects on everything, folliwing all the cascades up to the source you will eventually discover that the root problem is capitalism and the only solution is nationalizing means of production for the good of the people.

      No wait we tried that already and it didn't work. No there is no solution for capitalism, yet.
      Last edited by starshipeleven; 01-23-2020, 07:38 PM.

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      • #23
        Originally posted by birdie View Post
        How much have you donated to Android-x86 so far? Zero? Then why are you surprised?
        It's not obligatory to donate to projects for somebody to express their surprise, you know.

        I'm surprised because, while I've never used it, I had the feeling of regular coverage of android-x86 in news etc. I also thought it was backed by companies.

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        • #24
          Originally posted by starshipeleven View Post
          Sorry what, How many Android phones ever get a kernel patch in ever? Afaik only Google devices get them, and only very rarely when it is an actual functionality bug.
          Well, in that case, the situation is even worse than I thought, which sort of boggles the mind at least a little bit. But my point seems to get lost in the traffic somehow. I'm very well aware of the fact that we can't derive an ought from an is. Nothing serves better to remind me of the mental state of my surroundings than the fact of the pitiful month of December, when seemingly normal people decide to chop down ten year old trees, ending their lives, for the sole purpose of putting them in their living rooms so they can decorate them and dance around them in order to convince everyone but me, that they are the sane ones.
          Last edited by jo-erlend; 01-23-2020, 08:31 PM.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by jo-erlend View Post
            Well, in that case, the situation is even worse than I thought, which sort of boggles the mind at least a little bit. But my point seems to get lost in the traffic somehow.
            It makes more sense when you stop thinking of mobile devices as computers. PCs are an outlier, with actual standards and ridicolously huge retrocompatibility and user freedom, which is weirdly enforced by Microsoft's iron fist.

            For everything else it's always been like this, the concept of "operating system" and "updates" is completely alien, each product line is its own thing and it loses support as soon as legally possible.

            This is actually one of the reasons Linux is so big in embedded, because it allows manufacturers to keep doing like they always did and not having to conform to any standard or give up any of their freedoms.

            This is also one of the reasons quite a few people I know and some well-known tech youtubers have thrown their trust and support behind Sony's self-driving vehicle efforts without a second thought. Sony (due to playstations and other consumer electronics products they make) is likely to grasp the basics of complex computing devices needing isolation and to be locked down, also needing updates and long software support for bugs and whatnot. Meanwhile the average car manufacturer still fails to implement basic shit like securing car remote lock/unlock signals against attacks and still place the onboard media system on the CAN bus with total access to all onboard systems that actually run the damn car, while talking up of how they plan to make AI self-driving cars.

            Nothing serves better to remind me of the mental state of my surroundings than the fact of the pitiful month of December, when seemingly normal people decide to chop down ten year old trees, ending their lives, for the sole purpose of putting them in their living rooms so they can decorate them and dance around them in order to convince everyone but me, that they are the sane ones.
            I understand the feeling. Most of the "culture" and "tradition" around is basically a shared lie everyone wants to believe in because they think that's what "normal" people do and doing otherwise is bad.

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            • #26
              Anyone manage to get 9.0 RC2 to work in QEMU with Virgl? Android's Surfaceflinger GUI just crashes and reinitializes every few seconds with the 4.9 kernel variant and doesn't launch at all with the 4.19 kernel. Android 8.1 R3 4.9 works though.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by Xaero_Vincent View Post
                Anyone manage to get 9.0 RC2 to work in QEMU with Virgl? Android's Surfaceflinger GUI just crashes and reinitializes every few seconds with the 4.9 kernel variant and doesn't launch at all with the 4.19 kernel. Android 8.1 R3 4.9 works though.
                Likewise with VirtualBox. No idea how to make it work. Looks like Android9-x86 needs proper OpenGL ES HW acceleration to work.

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                • #28
                  Man, bunch of real Scrooges in here! FWIW Christmas trees are a farmed product, no different from grains, produce, eggs, meat, etc. Basically everything humans consume. "Ending their lives" LMAO bit dramatic aren't we? I had a salad for dinner tonight, how many lives were lost there? A dozen or so I'd wager. Those poor innocent tomatoes! #VeggieLivesMatter
                  Last edited by torsionbar28; 01-26-2020, 07:37 PM.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by torsionbar28 View Post
                    Man, bunch of real Scrooges in here! FWIW Christmas trees are a farmed product, no different from grains, produce, eggs, meat, etc. Basically everything humans consume. "Ending their lives" LMAO bit dramatic aren't we? I had a salad for dinner tonight, how many lives were lost there? A dozen or so I'd wager. Those poor innocent tomatoes! #VeggieLivesMatter
                    When I wiped my ass this morning I sent 1.7 billion organisms to their watery, flushing death. When I washed my hands I killed another 6.8 million. Later on I jerked off and killed 1.2 million unborn children. I'm a genocidal monster.

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by torsionbar28 View Post
                      Man, bunch of real Scrooges in here! FWIW Christmas trees are a farmed product, no different from grains, produce, eggs, meat, etc. Basically everything humans consume. "Ending their lives" LMAO bit dramatic aren't we? I had a salad for dinner tonight, how many lives were lost there? A dozen or so I'd wager. Those poor innocent tomatoes! #VeggieLivesMatter
                      Last I had Christmas tree at all (2014), I cut it with an axe from my own forest. There's also alternative way for it here: pay money to relevant State organization, pocket the receipt, grab an axe or saw and go pick your Christmas tree from State-owned forest. Upon running into Forestry service check, show your receipt and no further worries as long as you didn't cut more than you should have.
                      Same shit with meat, dairy products and eggs. If you bother to make an effort, you 'll find some farmer you can buy eggs, meat or milk from. Meat can be bought from hunters as well, if you know any. FYi: moose is extremely good-tasting and rather big animal.
                      Different countries, different ways. I do live in EU country. Usually in the city but family owns also a small farm. Hope I didn't cause any cardiac arrests among vegans.
                      Last edited by aht0; 01-27-2020, 04:33 AM.

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