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  • Civilization: Beyond Earth Overcoming Linux GPU Driver Problems

    Phoronix: Civilization: Beyond Earth Overcoming Linux GPU Driver Problems

    Aspyr Media has written a blog update concerning the state of the OS X and Linux port of Sid Meier's Civilization: Beyond Earth...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTgyMzY

  • gilboa
    replied
    Commander,

    I think your comment was not directed at my post.
    As I said, even though I have large number of nVidia based laptops, desktops and workstations, I have zero stability issues.

    Back to the OP, I believe people should wait before pre-ording Civ-BE.
    I bought CivV and I have yet to enjoy it crashes constantly on my Fedora workstation.
    I've contacted Asphir support, but thus far they were responsive and polite but gave me no meaningful answer and/or solution.
    At least by the vibe I get from the Asphyr support personal, they only officially supports Civ under SteamOS and they are not particularly inclined to support non-SteamOS installation.

    - Gilboa

    Leave a comment:


  • Commander
    replied
    Originally posted by gilboa View Post
    Calling 99% (made up number) of nVidia fanboys just because you were unlucky enough to be part of the "other" 1% is somewhat overstretching your (unlucky) personal experience.
    But in general, I always remind people, and I cannot stress this enough, that hardware and software configuration matters *a lot*.
    While I can give you at least 30 different nVidia based configurations that I know for a fact that they are rock solid, for the life of me I cannot promise that it will even boot if you stray one inch from any of these configurations.
    The same, BTW, is true for *any* installation of hardware on any type of system. This is way big companies pay big bucks for buying per-assembled and pre-tested HP/Dell/etc servers and workstations and keep to the tried-and-true configuration.

    - Gilboa
    What did dmesg/Xorg say about this then? Im guessing its an implementation issue in Ubuntu since a reinstall would also clear blacklisting etc.

    I personaly have switched between
    nVidia Asus GTX260+, (AMD 6370M), AMD XFX 5970, AMD XFX 6970, nVidia ZotacGTX670, and now lately nVidia MSI 970 Gaming
    Latest two nVidia cards since it was performance/dollar but also from past experiance on both my Laptop where i had "experimental" tag on my screen for a rebranded card and really unstable drivers for ~6months since i bought it and about the same issue with it as with 5970 and 6970 where FGLRX would freeze when launching games or graphics corruptions left and right.

    I would supply you the bugs i created in the unofficial repo http://ati.cchtml.com/ but most of them are removed because of "old" age.

    But short here are some that i created that still drag on:
    Multimonitor, corrupted mouse cursor. Had this on AMD hardware since Windows debacle had it couple of years ago. Took AMD few months to fix on Windows but never fixed this issue on Linux. Think i talked to about ~3-4 AMD reps through direct email and also this bug report.
    http://ati.cchtml.com/show_bug.cgi?id=134

    FGLRX profiling against Wine that limits the GPU, took some time but it was partially fixed since I last tested.
    http://ati.cchtml.com/show_bug.cgi?id=528

    All vendors have bugs, issue with me is that these are basic desktop usage and nothing specific that get dragged on without a fix or comment, release-notes etc. This drags on and you just feel left out and in the end just nag to a vendor that is like a brick wall. Things like graphic corruptions in Wine with AMD drivers that drag on and on.

    While I report something on nVidia forums i get mostly a dev response and a fix sooner or later. But atleast there is some response or help even on their IRC channel #nvidia on freenode.
    https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/t...hen-shooting-/
    https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/t...43-22/#4349856

    Sure I'm comparing here official and unofficial however i had no better luck contacting AMD directly and looking through their official part: http://devgurus.amd.com/community/steam-linux its the same dead horse where most is just updates from others/or bugreporters that the issue continues into next driver.

    I am willing to try AMD again but all i see and read is "its coming" from their reps on interviews/presentations or their twitter feed "We are commited to Linux" etc etc....
    AMD stepping up will not only help AMD users but also nVidia users since competition is good.

    My thoughts and experience with both vendors.

    Leave a comment:


  • gilboa
    replied
    nVidia issues aside, how's CivV stability? At least in my case, it blows up every 3-4 minutes.
    (In Asphyr's defense, I've opened a support request and, at least for now, they seem very helpful.)

    - Gilboa

    Leave a comment:


  • My8th
    replied
    Originally posted by gilboa View Post
    Calling 99% (made up number) of nVidia fanboys just because you were unlucky enough to be part of the "other" 1% is somewhat overstretching your (unlucky) personal experience.

    I think he was just generalizing about fanboys and not nVidia fanboys exclusively.

    I'm the only Android fanboy in my family everybody including extended family have Apple products. I'm not out to destroy them, all of us separate "brand" fanboys should just get together and love each other.

    Leave a comment:


  • gilboa
    replied
    Originally posted by vein View Post
    I have been using an AMD radeon 7950 for several years and it has been rock solid. I have just been geeting more and more performance for each new driver release. But since I felt that it was a time for an upgrade, (especially now that there are so many games coming to linux) I listened to people on the net (this forum and others) and bought me a Nvidia geforce GTX 770.

    The result was that X would not start for me. I uninstalled fglrx first and then installed the nvidia drivers and I could not get it to work. After a lot of fixing I decided to reinstall ubuntu completely and I still didn't get it to work. At last I thought the card was broken, so I took it back to the store and they tried it and said that there was nothing wrong with it. So I went to a friend and installed it in his windows 8.1 machine and it worked perfectly.
    So I sold the card to him with a small discount and reinstalled my 7950 again and now my computer is working perfectly again.

    I tell you this to show that Nvidia is not working perfectly all the time and I am not saying that AMD does either. But I have learned one thing of this: Do not listen too much on people on forums, since there are a lot of fanboys out there.
    Calling 99% (made up number) of nVidia fanboys just because you were unlucky enough to be part of the "other" 1% is somewhat overstretching your (unlucky) personal experience.
    But in general, I always remind people, and I cannot stress this enough, that hardware and software configuration matters *a lot*.
    While I can give you at least 30 different nVidia based configurations that I know for a fact that they are rock solid, for the life of me I cannot promise that it will even boot if you stray one inch from any of these configurations.
    The same, BTW, is true for *any* installation of hardware on any type of system. This is way big companies pay big bucks for buying per-assembled and pre-tested HP/Dell/etc servers and workstations and keep to the tried-and-true configuration.

    - Gilboa

    Leave a comment:


  • vein
    replied
    Originally posted by gilboa View Post
    Not that it invalidates your anecdotal example, but in the past 12 years i have had literally 100s of nVidia cards on dozens of machines ranging from low end ION atom netbooks, bumblebee notebooks, self built desktops up to high end Xeon workstations with Quadro GPUs, all running either Fedora or RHEL. Quick count puts me currently at around 30 active machines.

    ... And they are all *rock* solid.

    Either you are very unlucky or I am extremely lucky. You choose.
    (Or Fedora / RPMFusion may be very good at packaging nVidia, no idea)

    - Gilboa

    I have been using an AMD radeon 7950 for several years and it has been rock solid. I have just been geeting more and more performance for each new driver release. But since I felt that it was a time for an upgrade, (especially now that there are so many games coming to linux) I listened to people on the net (this forum and others) and bought me a Nvidia geforce GTX 770.

    The result was that X would not start for me. I uninstalled fglrx first and then installed the nvidia drivers and I could not get it to work. After a lot of fixing I decided to reinstall ubuntu completely and I still didn't get it to work. At last I thought the card was broken, so I took it back to the store and they tried it and said that there was nothing wrong with it. So I went to a friend and installed it in his windows 8.1 machine and it worked perfectly.
    So I sold the card to him with a small discount and reinstalled my 7950 again and now my computer is working perfectly again.

    I tell you this to show that Nvidia is not working perfectly all the time and I am not saying that AMD does either. But I have learned one thing of this: Do not listen too much on people on forums, since there are a lot of fanboys out there.

    Leave a comment:


  • gilboa
    replied
    Originally posted by benmoran View Post
    I'm not directing this solely at you, but:
    Just wanted to add that I'm "lucky" enough to have an Nvidia card in my work machine, and the proprietary driver crashed X about twice a week, like clockwork. It annoyed me to the point that I switched back to the integrated Intel graphics for a time, but Nouveau has thankfully improved enough since then to be a pleasant stable experience.

    Kudos to the Nouveau team for making my card usable. The Nvidia binary drivers tend to be good but if they don't work, you're pretty much screwed if not for Nouveau. My laptop and personal desktop both have APUs, both use the Radeon driver, and both run Civilization 5 perfectly. (I'm not holding out much hope for my laptop running this new one though )
    Not that it invalidates your anecdotal example, but in the past 12 years i have had literally 100s of nVidia cards on dozens of machines ranging from low end ION atom netbooks, bumblebee notebooks, self built desktops up to high end Xeon workstations with Quadro GPUs, all running either Fedora or RHEL. Quick count puts me currently at around 30 active machines.

    ... And they are all *rock* solid.

    Either you are very unlucky or I am extremely lucky. You choose.
    (Or Fedora / RPMFusion may be very good at packaging nVidia, no idea)

    - Gilboa

    Leave a comment:


  • whitecat
    replied
    Originally posted by emblemparade View Post
    The proprietary drivers don't use Mesa (well, AMD will use it in the future)
    No, AMD is currently developing an open-source kernel driver. The AMD's proprietary OpenGL driver will still be fglrx (and closed-source).

    Leave a comment:


  • emblemparade
    replied
    Originally posted by gamerk2 View Post
    I mean sheesh, the GPU's understand the function calls, so that leaves you just needing to implement the OS handling of all the data. It's not that hard, and more or less inexcusable the full OGL 4.x feature set isn't supported yet. The fact it isn't tells me there are more basic concerns within Linux that need re-evaluation.
    Are you new to Phoronix? Michael has been covering Mesa and Gallium3D progress for years. The proprietary drivers don't use Mesa (well, AMD will use it in the future), but instead support OpenGL on their own, and at the latest version with all the goodies. The free drivers still have a way to go. But you're such a genius, so maybe you can pitch in and solve all the issues.

    It is not trivial to support the newer OpenGL features. OpenGL does not map to the way the GPU is designed, and never has (it was created before GPUs really existed). There's a lot of stuff going on between Mesa and the Gallium3D tracker system to get these features running with good performance.

    This is part of the impetus for MANTLE and whatever-will-come-after-OpenGL: instead of having programmers fight the API, just give them more direct access to the GPU (in a portable way).

    Leave a comment:

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