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Ouya Game Console Performance Is Disappointing

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  • uid313
    replied
    Originally posted by Bookaroo
    I only want encourage this nice open source idea.
    No, you only want referrer points on Amazon you selfish egoistic jerk.

    Ouya sucks, because it requires you to enter your credit card details to even download the free games.

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  • grok
    replied
    Sorry the thread was about a two-week-old Ouya's disappointing performance, and I wanted to make a point (that was already made in a post somewhere else in a well known news site full of hairy basement dwellers)

    So, the Ouya is 73rd in a long list full of nearly identical devices and it's beaten by $800 cell phones and the like. It's slipped to 95th, too.
    So what? It's about 40% the performance of that unaffordable, brand new hardware. It beats quite a lot of brand name hardware too : LG Optimus, Asus Transformer Prime, Galaxy SII, Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD. It leaves older stuff in the dust.

    Maybe that's good enough?, for a $99 console with an expensive controller that also doubles as a computer, no "hacking", no warranty void, no FBI knocking on your door etc. so it can run those open source emulators full of code stolen from other open source projects, too.
    It seems more powerful than a Wii, Gamecube, Xbox 1, has HD output and more memory than Xbox 360/PS3, which won't give you Crisys on its own but is always nice. Hundreds millions people don't actually own such a powerful computer other than their crappy desktop or laptop PC, including me. No, we don't have drawers full of tablets and smartphones. I don't even give a shit about those things. Not everyone has an expensive console either, especially when they got so boring and noisy.

    It's cost competitive with a Raspberry Pi, actually. Buy a Raspi and a case, powered hub, SD card, USB keyboard, Ouya controller, shipping : I guess that's quite near $99, but what are you going to run on that.. open source Tetris? The Ouya is vastly more powerful and will run more stuff (more crap, too).
    The garbage collector will ruin it.. dunno. Not everything is a SNES emulator. I had a J2ME phone with a few downloaded games a decade ago, before I went to dumbphones, it sort of worked even though the hardware was primitive. At least it's not Flash or Perl, Python, or QBASIC lol.

    The only thing that makes me wary of it is the "Free to play" requirement, i.e. pay-to-win racket games, "addictive" pieces of crap and so on. Hope there's a way to filter out these games. A demo mode/first levels would be fine, then pay $5-$20 to get a full game would be fine (REAL GAMES please, Contra III, Goldeneye N64, Street Fighter II, shoot'em'ups were games for instance, I don't want farmville and bejeweled clones nor a crappy cutscenes and achievements fest like Call of Duty : Trigger the Script And Take Cover 27th edition)
    Last edited by grok; 04-28-2013, 04:38 AM.

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  • grok
    replied
    Originally posted by BO$$ View Post
    No socialism here in Europe for sure. Just look at France who just taxed the rich 90% so that every rich guy ran from that country in a couple of months. Absolutely no socialism here in Europe.
    Nope, it was 75% above one million euro (for salary income, not capital gains) and was struck down by the Constitutional Council.

    Originally posted by duby229 View Post
    I have a little nest egg. If counting that nest egg, I would be considered rich by socialist standards. Trust me I'm not rich. I work for a living. I still live paycheck to paycheck. But a socialist would have me burn through my savings just because it exists.
    Well the US is a badly run socialist country. Has a pretty high income tax too, I think. It's just more inefficient than eurowimp "socialist" countries because the democracy is terribly weak and they like spending $1 trillion on the F35 fighter jet and other gobs of shit rather than on something useful.
    Your healthcare is terribly inefficient, it's basically held by gangsters and you have to piss away a small fortune at them. Protection racket and they might kick you out if you get too sick, rendering all of it useless. You need more "socialism" there so that funnily the healthcare gets cheaper, bureaucratic wastes down and efficiency up.
    Feel free spending your money to these private taxation schemes, on top of your real taxes. But the gas is cheaper.

    LOL I guess that all the shit an american pays for (healthcare bill + out of pocket expenses, 401K, credit card bills, cable bill, mortgage interest) would be enough to live on.
    Last edited by grok; 04-28-2013, 03:47 AM.

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  • grok
    replied
    Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
    Yadda yadda yadda...

    I'll believe it for myself when I see a FOSS game with the same graphical quality and entertainment value of an AA-grade game (forget AAA-grade, not gonna happen) found on Windows, the PS3, the Wii, the Xbox or even the DSi / 3DS or PS Vita.

    If an analogue / comparison is desired, think Crysis 1-era graphics. The day I see a complete FOSS game that matches the gameplay value and graphical quality of Crysis 1 on 'Ultra' settings with the highest MSAA settings running on 60fps using open drivers is the day I'm convinced.
    That's not even the biggest issue. There's the Quake 3 engine available already, if you want decent enough graphics, 60fps and being able to run on many shitty linux PCs (though you'd be hard pressed to get 60fps with an open source driver on a 1.x GHz computer)

    But we only get boring ass multiplayer shooters that look like shit out of it (a.k.a. the Phoronix games benchmark suite). Even OpenArena, one of the better known of those and that has been around for a while, is greatly inferior to Quake 3, or Unreal Tournament, both 1999 games.
    These games are unplayable with a non-qwerty keyboard too, but I know to type "setxkbmap us". (just a little pain in the ass every time I want to "play". really it's just software that helps you see if your 3D acceleration works well, like glxgears 200 years ago)

    But I would like to play a nice and interesting single player game. A compelling campaign, even if there's no story and less production value than RTCW or MoHAA, but at least a nice set of maps that don't feel too disjointed, graphics that you can look at (not some dark shit you can't see through, nor Fischer-Price colors), nice sounding weapons and enemy AI on par with late 90s games.
    There's pretty much nothing at all (barring Cube single player maps, which are more of a tech demo if you can't/don't want to play deathmatch instead). Even FreeDoom doesn't have single player, the game drops you in an empty multiplayer map you can't escape ; I guess nobody could be arsed to draw the monsters.
    Last edited by grok; 04-28-2013, 03:10 AM.

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  • yogi_berra
    replied
    Originally posted by Vim_User View Post
    Because it would be censoring him. That behavior is allowed by the licenses, it is just you not liking that behavior. I doubt that we should censor anyone just because he does things you don't appreciate. He does not tell lies about you, no slander, so a ban would simply be not legitimate.
    In fact, Phoronix is very lenient with that, on many other forums you would have been banned for calling him a fat ass, mental insane, parasitic, for disrespecting anyone you answer to with calling them son or junior (you can save yourself to the time to type son or junior if you answer me, I am most likely older than you), even if they ask you not to do that because it is in fact disrespectful, and clearly shows that you have to boost your ego to feel superior to anyone else here, which is quite funny, since you know no one here personally.
    You have to heighten yourself above people you don't even know, which is really sad and says much more about you than you think.
    It's not slander. It's libel. Or at least it would be if he were not a fat ass, insane parasite. So unless you have proof that he is not a fat ass, insane parasite maybe you should just STFU.

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  • DanLamb
    replied
    Originally posted by bnolsen View Post
    ... vs the option of forcing programmers into using a JVM not matter what. Are you voting for locking out people who want to use low level because you are beating your JAVA/JVM drum????
    I was trying to point out that some of the anti-Java comments in this thread are simply unreasonable and not true.

    I never even implied "locking out people who want to use low level". That is unreasonable to accuse me of that.

    Android does impose Java/Dalvik in some ways, but they definitely let you do a lot with the NDK and C/C++/Renderscript as well.

    Google has clearly tried to accommodate different developer preferences. I understand they did not do so to your satisfaction, but I believe they actually give you much more choice than iOS, and they just can't please everyone.

    Originally posted by bnolsen View Post
    I'm not sure about java today but I know c# treats "stack" classes different form "heap" classes and that caused untold amounts of grief for him as well.
    That's usually touted as a C# benefit. Why would that cause problems? C++ can do stack allocation or heap allocation as well.

    Leave a comment:


  • Vim_User
    replied
    Originally posted by Squarepusher
    It is not as if you have any problems with censorship you hypocritical dipshit - read your earlier posts and see how much of a fool you just made yourself look right now



    That is what you said, right there. So STFU about 'censorship' already when you have zero problems with 'censorship'.


    Read the above you hypocritical dipshit where you are CALLING FOR SOMEBODY TO BE BANNED because he says things you don't appreciate. Egg in your face there.
    I do not want him banned because I don't like what he posts, I want him banned because he uses slander and openly accuses the OpenBSD people to be terrorists. And you talk to me about selective reading?
    Disqualifying yourself is a thing that you are really good at, as it seems.
    Anyone can see that you are an asshole, but that doesn't mean that you should be censored, or anyone else, as long as you are not going the criminal way, as this antiBSD troll did several times, but BO$$ not, he is, like you, just the usual troll.

    Ie. you people on Phoronix are sellout pieces of shit trying to 'hide' behind legalese to justify toxic, fraudulent behavior.
    Oh wait, here you crossed the line, you are accusing people here of fraud, now come up with evidence for that or STFU, because this is slander otherwise.

    Pathetic little MBA conmen living in Europe/America that 'think' they will become the next 'big startup' by making games with pathetic graphics and even more pathetic gameplay AND (here is the key) GETTING RICH OFF RIPPING OFF GPL'ED GAME ENGINES WHOLESALE. Dude - hate to break it to you - but the entire lot of you will be facing foreclosure within two years after the bubble has burst on your 'indie' asses.
    I am not a developer, so you can't mean me with that outburst, but when you think that using GPL'ed engines for something that actually brings the developers some money is a rip-off then you are clearly a zealot that doesn't even understand the GPL. If you think that there is a license violation then go and report that to the appropriate place, there are people that are interested in that. Otherwise you should better say nothing, since you make a fool of yourself (too late, but anyways).

    You are either a sellout or you are not - you are either a disgusting maggot piece of shit or you are not. And you lot that think 'the license allows the behavior' are just that - maggot pieces of shit.
    So using the license in the way it is written is only good if you approve that it is in the way that you think is right, otherwise people using the licenses are maggots? Man, you are pathetic.

    Kindly fuck off and get your ass out of the 'software engineering' industry already so the world can be a better place for all of us - you have no morals, no integrity, no backbone, no nothing - and you should get out and get lost .
    I am not a software engineer, so you can't mean me with that, but I have a question for you. You are a developer of an emulator. BO$$ is a game developer. How would he quitting game developing make the world a better place for a developer of an emulator? How would make it emulating proprietary platforms (there goes your higher moral) easier or better for you?
    Besides that, you know nothing about me, so you judging my morals, integrity or backbone is again just another pathetic attempt to place your own ego on a higher ground. You really seem to need that.

    Leave a comment:


  • bnolsen
    replied
    Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
    Yes, this thread has mostly devolved into pure garbage.

    Your comment is civil but I completely disagree.

    I used to do a ton of work on production apps doing high performance concurrent programming in C++: first threads are typically *way* slower than asynchronous programming. On C++/Windows, I used what Microsoft called IOCP (completion ports). On *nix/C++ the TCP select api has async logic. I saw dramatic performance increases going from threads to async. We ultimately did use threads, but just one thread per CPU core. The primary concurrency mechanism was async logic.

    See multi-language high performance server benchmarks here:
    http://www.techempower.com/blog/2013...works-round-2/
    So we're back to the fun of me offering a theoretical working solution where people have the freedom to chose what language to use which gives them what they want vs the option of forcing programmers into using a JVM not matter what. Are you voting for locking out people who want to use low level because you are beating your JAVA/JVM drum????

    The server I was working on was initially written back ending microsoft's terraserver for extracting, mosaicking and reprojecting ortho mosaics on the fly. Not your typical high transaction database type website. At this level async, thread overhead is totally irrelevant, the code path, memory allocation and management, socket cross talk becomes significant. That was back in the days of java7 so that's why I'm not going to argue much about the merits of those languages. Current high performance work is for multisensor digital payloads including digital cameras, lidar, etc. Sensor internal and external calibration, geometric trajectory correction etc, least squares systems, radiometric correction, on and on. Some of my work involves aggressive paging and in memory compression so I don't blow out 128GB ram.

    My partner a year or so ago did some work transferring technology to another party and worked some with c#. His experience was that simple semi low level operations using matrices, etc were close with c++. But when he started chaining things together to do something useful with these low level operations the difference in performance started to heavily favor the c++ side. And the equation formulation, readabilty, etc was worse with c#, not to mention VM overhead and memory use. I'm not sure about java today but I know c# treats "stack" classes different form "heap" classes and that caused untold amounts of grief for him as well.

    Leave a comment:


  • DanLamb
    replied
    Originally posted by bnolsen View Post
    Wow this thread went way off the deep end. Went from a semi civil discussion to a slugfest. From my experience writing high performance multi-threaded stuff, both desktop and server space I've always found java to be wanting. It just compromises too much and it's not that good a language. With all its warts c++ has been flexible enough to fit totally different programming paradigms. c++-11 is great, another huge boost. java doesn't stand this same test of time. Garbage collection is just pure fad. It's been a non issue in c++ programs for a very long time.
    Yes, this thread has mostly devolved into pure garbage.

    Your comment is civil but I completely disagree.

    I used to do a ton of work on production apps doing high performance concurrent programming in C++: first threads are typically *way* slower than asynchronous programming. On C++/Windows, I used what Microsoft called IOCP (completion ports). On *nix/C++ the TCP select api has async logic. I saw dramatic performance increases going from threads to async. We ultimately did use threads, but just one thread per CPU core. The primary concurrency mechanism was async logic.

    A lot of people are using node.js for high performance async development. And, that uses the JavaScript language which is not known for high performance.

    Java has the netty library for async development. Scala has much more elegant syntax for async development.

    See multi-language high performance server benchmarks here:
    http://www.techempower.com/blog/2013...works-round-2/

    I don't think GC is a problem for server or high performance concurrent programming. Google writes much of their services in Java, and they are known for super responsive server apps.

    I'm skeptical that GC is a problem in games. Even if it were a problem, you can remove or minimize any memory allocations that happen in your inner render loop. Java games like Wakfu seem to be completely responsive and performant.

    I was comfortable with manual memory allocation in C++. GC isn't one of the important features to me in Java/Scala.

    Leave a comment:


  • Vim_User
    replied
    Originally posted by Squarepusher
    That is called parasitical behavior - and frankly I find it surprising that a site like Phoronix that likes to brand themselves as 'open source Linux' fans would tolerate that kind of behavior and why they haven't banned you yet just for stating this out loud.
    Because it would be censoring him. That behavior is allowed by the licenses, it is just you not liking that behavior. I doubt that we should censor anyone just because he does things you don't appreciate. He does not tell lies about you, no slander, so a ban would simply be not legitimate.
    In fact, Phoronix is very lenient with that, on many other forums you would have been banned for calling him a fat ass, mental insane, parasitic, for disrespecting anyone you answer to with calling them son or junior (you can save yourself to the time to type son or junior if you answer me, I am most likely older than you), even if they ask you not to do that because it is in fact disrespectful, and clearly shows that you have to boost your ego to feel superior to anyone else here, which is quite funny, since you know no one here personally.
    You have to heighten yourself above people you don't even know, which is really sad and says much more about you than you think.

    Leave a comment:

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