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Valve Announces Steam Deck As Portable SteamOS + AMD Powered Portable PC

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  • relsi1053
    replied
    Originally posted by xorbe View Post
    Tech specs: https://www.steamdeck.com/en/tech

    Assuming the ram is single channel, for a device this small.
    ram is quad channel

    Leave a comment:


  • sweetsuicide
    replied
    I was thinking, the presentation mentions "use it as a pc as it is one". Could it be that people could be more inclined to switch to Linux Destkops for the first time in history? Could it be that we could have more people working on Linux software in an open and collaborative way? Could it be that we could end up having an extremely user friendly linux environment for the masses?
    I thought of that, and I seriously hope that at least some of my hopes will come to life.
    Another great thing could be that nothing prevents people from having virtual machines on a device like the SteamDeck. I'm thrilled

    Leave a comment:


  • Quackdoc
    replied
    Originally posted by doomie View Post

    Also if they want any devs to make Deck-hardware-specific optimizations, which they AND WE do want, having non-standard hardware throws that out the window. Sometimes for user experience, less is actually more. Sounds like the guy just wants a gaming laptop.
    No. I want them to not bullshit us. I have very large doubts that plugging this into a TV, most of which nowadays are 4k, but even 1080p will be a good experience in most games. 1.5 Tflops in anemic for this use case, if it was strictly a 720p portable gaming PC fine, for 300 dollars sure. but don't advertised what isn't really capable, then not even give the end user a way to make up the deficiency themselves.

    as I said, I was hoping for something more compelling hardware wise. looking at benchmarks of similar specd machines (as I said, you cant do it dead on, but you can get close) its performance over the switch is disappointing IMO. that is all, I already said I expect it to sell, Its fine for the price, the hardware is understandable, but I would absolutely pay more, for a better preforming machine. or at least let us make up for the downsides ourselves.

    Leave a comment:


  • Quackdoc
    replied
    Originally posted by Citan View Post
    Double bullshit, big time.
    Performance will be necessarily better if only because one can actually adjust graphical rendering with game options.
    Also, while I recognize that custom hardware with paired custom toolset and instructions can lead to awesome performance per raw power...
    You are saying a hardware with low-range, 1/4 quantity of DDR4 and maybe 1/5 of the raw processing power of Steam Deck would "provide comparable performance"? LOL.
    Flops, is a relatively good indicator of gpu performance not perfect, but good enough for most cases. you can find benchmarks of similar spec'd systems and compare them with Swtich benchmarks, Ive checked doom eternal and Witcher myself, and while I realize those are the top tier for optimization on the switch, they do not preform drastically different. in most cases you can bump a few settings. running at 1080p still needs a 50% res scale for similar graphics quality, which puts it into the same ballpark as the switch. I don't care about anything else, I care about ingame preformance, and this does not feel like a couple generations ahead, it feels like a generation.

    As for "no real incentive other than a different library of games"?
    - Access to every productivity app you want (at least Linux native ones. I'm dubious on how easy it would be installing MS Office / Photoshope / Autocad / whatever else compared to classic Linux distro, patience and sweat from admin).
    its a portable gaming console does this matter to the majority of people? no. maybe for a couple of people that want the portability of a GPD but don't need the keyboard.
    - Access to games that largely expands beyond just steam (Linux native and fully ported games, Gog ported games, hardware emulators).
    this is exactly what I said. different games library

    - Multiplayer without added cost for online (hello Nintendo online) or local (broad compatibility of devices, so each player can bring whatever gamepad he loves), or network (it's a Linux behind after all).
    I will concede this point. I personally don't mind paying for nintendo's craptastic service to play with my friends. but I guess that would matter for some.

    - Unrestricted communication tools (Discord, Mumble, own Steam, Gog, whatever you like).
    - Unrestricted multimedia tools (Vlc, free access to whatever streaming / download sources you like to use).
    this matters to the vast minority of people. particularly the communication tools. sure their might be a few people who would like discord on switch, but I doubt for many it's an important factor. Same with multimedia tools, as long as it has a player that can play the majority of videos people don't care what they use. I do wish we had things like netflix on the switch. but I doubt we will get controller friendly streaming apps anytime soon for the deck, but I would love to be proven wrong on this one. (well outside of running android in a VM on the deck, but on the flip side you can dualboot switch with android by modding)

    - Ability to use as a mobile PC (something urgent to do, like a mail? Tactile keyboard may suffice, otherwise you can plug usb keyboard or pair any bluetooth device) or a full PC (put on desktop, plug usb hub which connects screen and peripherals, you're set).
    see comment about GPD. I doubt this is a great portion of people thinking about this or the switch.

    I may come as irrespectful here, but honestly, did you plug your brain before reading about this machine?
    There are interrogations and potential causes of failure: actual compatibility of steam games on Linux -and traditional proprietary apps!!- without any action required from user, build quality, autonomy and perfs matching what's announced, quality of ongoing software support and hardware replacement...
    But on paper this is an absolute beast.

    Doing so would have probably condemned the machine.
    First, it would have required very extensive R&D effort to find proper external case, and ensure compatibility.
    Second, it would have added on production cost to cater for likely 0, 01% of target audience, for a device that will be already clearly sold at no profit (or so little) at least for upcoming 2 years.
    Third, it would have sent a very bad message to general audience, giving a vague feeling like "we think integrated power won't be enough sooner than later so we plan ahead".
    Fourth, it would have ultimately be wasted investment, because if one really is in the mindset of using an external gpu, it means (s)he has both the space and the treasury (especially the latter) to buy high-end ultraportables with support for egpu, like the very recent (and VERY PROPRIETARY sadly) 13'' Asus ROG Flow.
    On which installing Linux should prove easy enough if you want it.

    1.5 tflops is not a beast in PC computing. thats about as much as the original PS4. and yeah, its the best PC has to offer interms of this form factor, but its NOT a beast by any means. this is advertised as an device you can plug into your TV and its targeting 720p - low 1080p. the switch could do it as 4k TVs weren't all that popular at the time. but now is different. nearly everyone I know, and every TV sold in all the shops in my large town, are 4k. the specs are downright anemic for the use case, regardless of cost.

    you don't need an external case, you don't even need to ensure compatibility or advertise eGPU support. Thunderbolt/USB4 is all that is needed. and maybe it would have driver up costs a bit to implement, or maybe even a lot. but its a shit ton better than misleading your potential customers. the steam deck WILL NOT do 1080p60 at high settings for many games. hell I doubt it will be the majority excluding indie or Graphically simple games.

    It shouldn't cost too much to implement, they don't need their own egpu solution. but at least the option would be there. Thankfully it turns out that infact, the deck DOES have an nvme m.2 slot and it is not soldered. so now we still have an avenue to go.

    but for the vast majority of people thinking about buying either the deck or the switch, the deck is a lot less compelling than I hoped it would be.

    Leave a comment:


  • doomie
    replied
    Originally posted by Citan View Post

    ...
    Doing so would have probably condemned the machine.
    First, it would have required very extensive R&D effort to find proper external case, and ensure compatibility.
    Second, it would have added on production cost to cater for likely 0, 01% of target audience, for a device that will be already clearly sold at no profit (or so little) at least for upcoming 2 years.
    Third, it would have sent a very bad message to general audience, giving a vague feeling like "we think integrated power won't be enough sooner than later so we plan ahead"...
    Also if they want any devs to make Deck-hardware-specific optimizations, which they AND WE do want, having non-standard hardware throws that out the window. Sometimes for user experience, less is actually more. Sounds like the guy just wants a gaming laptop.
    Last edited by doomie; 19 July 2021, 12:30 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Citan
    replied
    Originally posted by Alexmitter View Post
    That does not change the fact that for a Workstation OS, KDE is simply to broken, to heavy and too buggy for being the default. No reputable workstation linux distro ships KDE by default. Thats not fanboyism
    Hahahahahahahaha. Ha.

    Thanks for the free laugh, it's always good for morale.

    Originally posted by TemplarGR View Post
    You seem like a nintendo fanboi. .
    Guy accuses someone to be a fanboy...
    Originally posted by TemplarGR View Post
    You claimed that Nintendo games are excellent, which is a huge lie. Nintendo games are bad, it is just that they make crappy underpowered consoles so their games get no competition.
    And follows with that.

    This thread is filled with self-unaware clowns it seems XD
    Thanks for distracting and providing us with stress-relieving laughs.

    Leave a comment:


  • kpedersen
    replied
    Originally posted by scirocco View Post

    Actually since gnome 40, gnome is a bit ligher on the memory then kde, fresh boot with standard install of kde on arch, my kde is 750mb, while my gnome 40 is 700 mb.
    700mb is absurd! There are desktop systems requiring a 10th of that and with at least double the functionality.

    Even the Windows NT 4.x shell (20mb) puts this to shame in terms of functionality.
    Last edited by kpedersen; 19 July 2021, 08:17 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Citan
    replied
    Originally posted by Quackdoc View Post

    no. I'm stuck on the fact that a piece of hardware is going to preform in real world scenarios in the same ballpark as a piece of hardware from 2015 and yet offering no real incentive other than a different library of games. the steam deck is the worst parts about consoles with little of the good. in comparing to the switch, which is a direct competitor in terms of price, and size.
    Double bullshit, big time.
    Performance will be necessarily better if only because one can actually adjust graphical rendering with game options.
    Also, while I recognize that custom hardware with paired custom toolset and instructions can lead to awesome performance per raw power...
    You are saying a hardware with low-range, 1/4 quantity of DDR4 and maybe 1/5 of the raw processing power of Steam Deck would "provide comparable performance"? LOL.

    As for "no real incentive other than a different library of games"?
    - Access to every productivity app you want (at least Linux native ones. I'm dubious on how easy it would be installing MS Office / Photoshope / Autocad / whatever else compared to classic Linux distro, patience and sweat from admin).
    - Access to games that largely expands beyond just steam (Linux native and fully ported games, Gog ported games, hardware emulators).
    - Multiplayer without added cost for online (hello Nintendo online) or local (broad compatibility of devices, so each player can bring whatever gamepad he loves), or network (it's a Linux behind after all).
    - Unrestricted communication tools (Discord, Mumble, own Steam, Gog, whatever you like).
    - Unrestricted multimedia tools (Vlc, free access to whatever streaming / download sources you like to use).
    - Ability to use as a mobile PC (something urgent to do, like a mail? Tactile keyboard may suffice, otherwise you can plug usb keyboard or pair any bluetooth device) or a full PC (put on desktop, plug usb hub which connects screen and peripherals, you're set).

    I may come as irrespectful here, but honestly, did you plug your brain before reading about this machine?
    There are interrogations and potential causes of failure: actual compatibility of steam games on Linux -and traditional proprietary apps!!- without any action required from user, build quality, autonomy and perfs matching what's announced, quality of ongoing software support and hardware replacement...
    But on paper this is an absolute beast.

    Originally posted by Quackdoc View Post
    I wouldn't consider buying this without egpu support. the apu is simply to weak gpu wise for modern TVs many of which you can get 4k for cheap. and docking it IS an advertised usecase. and comparing to switch isn't even fair considering the age of the two systems.
    Doing so would have probably condemned the machine.
    First, it would have required very extensive R&D effort to find proper external case, and ensure compatibility.
    Second, it would have added on production cost to cater for likely 0, 01% of target audience, for a device that will be already clearly sold at no profit (or so little) at least for upcoming 2 years.
    Third, it would have sent a very bad message to general audience, giving a vague feeling like "we think integrated power won't be enough sooner than later so we plan ahead".
    Fourth, it would have ultimately be wasted investment, because if one really is in the mindset of using an external gpu, it means (s)he has both the space and the treasury (especially the latter) to buy high-end ultraportables with support for egpu, like the very recent (and VERY PROPRIETARY sadly) 13'' Asus ROG Flow.
    On which installing Linux should prove easy enough if you want it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Citan
    replied
    Originally posted by mdedetrich View Post

    Maybe but this would be concerning if its a primary factor because they should pick the DE that is best for the users, not what Valve happens to use internally. Those are 2 very separate things, i.e. a highly customized DE for development/engineering is not the same thing that general users want for a gaming platform
    Well, then it's a good thing they DID pick the DE that is best for the users then. XD
    Reliable, default experience close enough to the latest Windows so that users can get their marks quick (also, JFYI, the "icon taskbar" on Linux largely predates Windows 7 but that's offtopic), but highly configurable so Valve could make tweaks related to "gaming platform" without too much headache.

    And a lot of great applications provided fully integrated (although I doubt Valve would preinstall them, but we'll see I guess).

    Originally posted by mdedetrich View Post
    This I somewhat agree with but TBH its a pretty minor point considering you are going primarily spend almost all of your time in SteamOS on this thing. Hooking it up to a display and using it like a computer is nice but in reality its a gimmik/perk and not the main point of the device
    Not for me, by far. Currently I do everything on a laptop, which is, well, nice, but I feel compelled to always carry it with me wherever I go. This kind of peripheral would be enough to do some streaming, listen to audio confs / podcasts on the move, and remotely connect to some servers for light ssh administration in emergency. And plugged into a screen and keyboard, it would offer twice or thrice the processing power of my current laptop, which was a high-end one in 2017.

    My only constraint would be, for my own development purposes, to actually learn how I could programmatically start and stop server processes "depending on context" so it doesn't drain battery when I'm using it for gaming or whatnot. I guess it would be easy with containers. ^^
    Paired with a remote free cloud for data and system backup, I'd finally have a light weight, compact all-in-one device including for gaming (I really don't care about being in 720 on the go). Maybe I could finally put a dent in my gaming backlist while taking subway or train. XD

    Leave a comment:


  • user1
    replied
    Originally posted by scirocco View Post

    Actually since gnome 40, gnome is a bit ligher on the memory then kde, fresh boot with standard install of kde on arch, my kde is 750mb, while my gnome 40 is 700 mb.
    I have no idea why is memory usage on Arch different compared to other distros, as someone also posted before. I've used Manjaro KDE, Opensuse Tumbleweed KDE, Kubuntu and all of them consistently used 520-550 MB on cold boot. When I tried Ubuntu, it used 1.3 GB. I haven't tried any other Gnome distros, but I've seen Fedora Gnome and Manjaro Gnome also use 1.3 GB.
    Last edited by user1; 18 July 2021, 01:29 PM.

    Leave a comment:

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