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Steam On Linux Still Tap Dancing Around 0.9% Marketshare

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    nanonyme
    Senior Member

  • nanonyme
    replied
    Originally posted by ezst036 View Post

    I do believe that back in the day Gabe addressed this himself, but its been a while so I don't specifically remember. The short answer is The Windows Store/The Microsoft Store is why so much effort is happening.

    What would happen to the Steam client if Microsoft locked up the storefront and only allowed the Microsoft store on their platform?

    Valve needed an insurance policy. Linux is that policy.
    Well, the way things are blowing is Steam Store may end up getting promoted through Windows Store.

    Leave a comment:

  • blackiwid
    Senior Member

  • blackiwid
    replied
    Originally posted by yoshi314 View Post

    it mostly was. but if you sit around on linux forums you'll see people who cannot even get their storage working, or having boot loops in the live media. or the live media randomly booting or hanging on startup.

    quite often it boils down to hardware quirks, e.g. system has two sata controllers and one is a bit off. or some other trickery. sometimes there are regressions in the kernel used on the media or hardware requires something special to get working.

    so maybe the 'forget about it' part is true, but the 'install' part is sometimes really tricky.
    It depends as you say on the distribution, sure a expert linux user that likes to take control over their live, will not give up just because of a boot loop and priotises his wish to install this specific distribution and will likely find the problem and send a bugreport and get a workaround or make it fixed upstream, but for the average unpatient user how about just assuming that the distro you chose sucks not "linux sucks"... and go to a different distribution.

    I had once problems with Pop os! and a boot loop after installing it had to do with secure boot, I think the installer gave not even the choice to use legacy boot but could be wrong, so ok it's no major distribution, just go to the big names like ubuntu / arch linux / fedora / debian maybe suse did I forget one? and you are good to go.

    And yes if you use Nvidia Hardware your choice might be different than with amd. And if you don't like any choice then well why would you want to install than any linux distro in the first place? The whole point of linux is to have choices, be able to choose between different desktop environments as example.

    I think the question is not what does linux worse than windows, then of course not all games are supported, the question is what does it better, and just because some people have some issues with linux doesn't make windows not have such issues I had with my gaming pc that for some reason the pc woke up alone after some time when I put him in suspend mode... had to deactivate some feature of the network card and had to type in some magic bullshit in the dos box. That made the pc basically unusable I work in linux and when I want to game if I have to boot like 10hours before I can start playing that's unusable to me.

    But you also have the forced reboots with updates and till windows 10 you had unusable destkop all windows were full screen no expose feature nothing, it was absolute horror, now with windows 11 they added I workspaces and tiling. So literally only animals could use windows before Windows 11. I mean as game starter if you hold yourself from puking when using a few tools here and there to do some tasks it was just a headage.

    Even tried to replace a harddisk in windows? Heck till recently replacing something simple as a mainboard and different (both 64 bit so same architecture) pc often required a fresh install, but just move the data from 1 disk to another? to replace it? Under linux lvm just add the harddisk as second device move the blocks to the new device remove the old harddisk. Heck this all works even ONLINE. with zero interruption you can even do all that without any boots, with hotplug.

    A simple software raid, yes windows has something simple but nothing that compares to lvm or btrfs raid or software raid. btrfs filesystem all the other features... and if you have any interest in linux you have it installed as second OS anyway, so you have the admin costs of linux anyway... that's the real question if you have zero interest in linux, well yes then linux is not your windows 1:1 replacement with some advantages... at least not yet, that might change at least to some degree with the new valve handheld, and if it's only with that hardware.

    And of course all the surveillance. But yes I think the forced reboot is something I would take as far as people go with their gun rights, that a company takes dictatorship over my pc and reboots it against my will is such a infrengement on my liberty, it has a bigger impact on my live than if I would taken away my vote. Call me a radical but I just find that outrages, which of course is just a small practical way to see that you have zero control over your pc using their OS. I mean there are plenty of others, that you deactivate updates and it still installs certain updates, or that some people got just forced windows 10 upgrades on their computers, etc. That makes this OS a joke...

    Leave a comment:

  • chocolate
    Senior Member

  • chocolate
    replied
    Originally posted by avem View Post
    Better how?
    Thank you for asking! Again, this is all anecdotal and is a summary of my own experience, that of users on ProtonDB, and that of users on Steam discussions. In short: it depends on the game!

    Some don't work out of the box on Windows 10 and people have to tinker with compatibility workarounds, whereas Proton boots them just fine.

    Some have spotty controller support, or controller support in general is a pain in Windows itself, so people have to use sketchy third party software to remap their controllers and such; Steam Input/Proton/Linux drivers handle pretty much all cases for me.
    Games where an Xbox 360 wired controller wasn't supposed to work do indeed work for me, some I've played with a Wii U Pro controller via Bluetooth with a profile on Steam Input or with no configuration at all. Once or twice I plugged in a PS3 controller via USB, maybe enabled a check on Steam Input, booted a local co-op Proton game with a friend and it worked just like an XInput controller.

    Again, it depends, and it's anecdotal evidence, but there's a lot of it in ProtonDB that has to do with performance. Some people over there can make direct comparisons to their Windows installations; I can't, my Windows days are long over, but I don't recall ever having such luck with plug&play stuff with any Windows version up to 10, either on my devices or my friends' devices.
    Some Windows users are using DXVK to improve performance with their D3D9~D3D11 games, see GTA4. They are the ones that have to download a file and drop it in a specific path, while my experience is transparent and integrated. While I'm obviously happy they have that tool at their disposal, I find this somewhat funny.

    Originally posted by avem View Post
    And what about NVIDIA/AMD Drivers Control Panels 95% of whose features are not available under Linux?
    What about undervolting/fan curves/power limiting under Linux out of the box? Without using weird repos from github with software no one can vouch for?
    Good questions. I know some users lament this lack of official GUIs even here on Phoronix. I've never found a use for those on Windows, so I will admit straight ahead that my opinion probably isn't worth much here.

    Performance-wise I sometimes make use of Feral Interactive's GameMode, it seems to do alright and it's certainly from a trusted party.

    I don't know about the rest, as it's tangential to gaming but I don't consider it essential, e.g. fan curves are not an issue for me, since I use a chassis with a horizontal layout and two 140mm fans adjacent to the GPU, pushing air towards it so that it's never too stressed. Those con be configured via the motherboard's GUI and the ones on the GPU are never too loud for me to care.

    Originally posted by avem View Post
    What about anticheat solutions? Do they work under Linux?
    Some do, some don't. I check ProtonDB before buying to know whether I'll be able to play a game with friends online. To my understanding, anticheats that don't currently work require kernel intervention and a solution is being worked on. So maybe the situation will improve in the coming months and years?

    Originally posted by avem View Post
    What about RTX/DLSS support? OK, the latter is proprietary but the former is a standard and implemented in Vulkan as well.
    I have no clue and my RX 5700 isn't capable of any of that anyway. I bought it precisely to play raster games on GNU/Linux.
    My limited understanding is that the latest Nvidia drivers offer Linux users support for DLSS games via Proton, and that DXVK/VKD3D or whatever should translate the API calls for ray tracing, thus making it transparent if the drivers expose it. Might not be the case at the moment, I don't know.

    Originally posted by avem View Post
    What about proper OSD monitoring? Yeah, mongohud exists, what about configuring it using UI without editing and debugging god knows what text files? Oh, and mongohud doesn't always work, sometimes it's mangohud app, sometimes it's MANGOHUD=1 vkcube, sometimes it's MANGOHUD_DLSYM=1 mangohud glxgears.

    You see, under Windows I install MSI Afterburner and I'm done. It works for AMD and NVIDIA. Everything in once place, easily configurable with a ton of options.
    I see, so this goes back to the lack of widely accepted GUIs to do things that are tangential to gaming. I currently have no use for HUDs either, but I understand.

    Originally posted by avem View Post
    Again, Linux gaming is for those who have too much spare time and want to constantly learn and adapt. Under Windows it's "Install" followed by "Run".

    And people wonder why Linux gaming doesn't take off. No everyone around is eager to dabble with command line and Googling to make things work. Some just want to play as they have more pressing issues in their lives.
    Hey, that's exactly why I'm happy with my dedicated Pop!_OS gaming installation! Zero maintenance and all that. I suppose Linux is just better where it matters -- to me.

    Cheers and happy gaming once again.

    Leave a comment:

  • mozo
    Phoronix Member

  • mozo
    replied
    Oh, yes, it's easier - you don't have to go anywhere searching what to download and you don't have to download anything manually like Windows users are forced to do. While you are opening your browser I'm already downloading
    Makepkg always works for it's downloads for you all dependencies automagically, without user's interaction. And actually Arch is very easy. If you want to install the official driver, you have to just open Octopi, Pamac etc, type NVIDIA and install it. There's no compiling for it's a binary package. Three clicks for childs. If that's hard for you, sell yout PC and go hermiting.
    mozo
    Phoronix Member
    Last edited by mozo; 03 July 2021, 07:39 AM.

    Leave a comment:

  • mdedetrich
    Senior Member

  • mdedetrich
    replied
    Originally posted by mozo View Post
    Nobody drive you to Ubuntu by force. On Arch I can install whatever NVIDIA driver version I want with a blink of an eye. With terminal, sure, but it's a child's play:
    Code:
    git clone https://github.com/Frogging-Family/nvidia-all.git
    cd nvidia-all
    makepkg -si (choose a version)
    sudo mkinitcpio -P
    Done.
    Not everyone uses arch, and this is still much harder than what you have to do Windows.

    And finally what you said isn't completely correct because makepkg only works if you have all of the other development packages installed (since you are building on source). Ontop of this since you are building direct from source, it can actually break if there is a regression in master/main. Ontop of this the package you mentioned is not even officially supported, good luck for the novice user trying to get support for this in Arch/Manjaro forums.

    So yeah, actually great job in showing how Arch is not user friendly for novice people. FYI not even Arch says their distribution is easier, they say that its simpler which is not the same thing at all.

    Leave a comment:

  • mozo
    Phoronix Member

  • mozo
    replied
    Nope, nobody here's talk about Arch. And DE is the same DE on every distro, so you don't know what you are talking about at all.

    Leave a comment:

  • HEL88
    Phoronix Member

  • HEL88
    replied
    Originally posted by mozo View Post

    Yet another good joke. Mint is kids distribution, don't blame Linux for Mint's flaws.
    Joke?? GUI in distribution like UBUNTU or Mint has enormous less bugs than Arch, Slackware.

    You are just fanboys who use arch or slack and you divide linux comunity.

    Leave a comment:

  • mdedetrich
    Senior Member

  • mdedetrich
    replied
    Originally posted by mppix View Post

    Since when are windows GPU drivers and games not patched for each other?
    It just happens more behind the scene...
    Of course but thats the point!

    Its not even really possible to do this on Linux because the graphics drivers are tied to the release cycle of the Linux kernel which is incredibly flexible.

    Leave a comment:

  • lowflyer
    Senior Member

  • lowflyer
    replied
    Well, I think all it takes is a single AAA title that can't be played on windo$e.

    Leave a comment:

  • mozo
    Phoronix Member

  • mozo
    replied
    Nobody drive you to Ubuntu by force. On Arch I can install whatever NVIDIA driver version I want with a blink of an eye. With terminal, sure, but it's a child's play:
    Code:
    git clone https://github.com/Frogging-Family/nvidia-all.git
    cd nvidia-all
    makepkg -si (choose a version)
    sudo mkinitcpio -P
    Done.

    Leave a comment:

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