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Wine 4.6 Released With Initial Bits Towards Vulkan WineD3D Backend

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  • #21
    Originally posted by torbido View Post
    I don't think that they will implemented DX11 to Vulkan from scratch, they will just integrate DXVK to Wine.

    DXVK is still in development, and if you have problem with it, it will be better to report it in DXVK's GitHub.

    The micro-stutter can be overcome with using Esync, Feral gamemode, Proton FS hack, and disabling compositions during gaming. You will not get the same performance as Windows, but it will be a little close.
    You have to remember wined3d will be expanded to support Vulkan as well. So we are going to have two Dx11 implementation backed on Vulkan options.

    Extending wined3d to support Vulkan as well as opengl is not starting from scratch and its not integrating DXVK into wine either. The company behind wine project wanted to bring in DXVK lead developer to help with this process. If they cannot get him they will still do this anyhow.

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    • #22
      Originally posted by sdack View Post
      And while it's faster than OpenGL - only thanks to Vulkan of course - is it also no where near the speed of Windows itself. It remains a slow solution and the choice of using OpenGL or Vulkan remains about as pathetic as two homeless guys who are fighting over a banana. Even when you there get a title to run solid at 60 fps+vsync with DXVK does it still produce microstutter and just doesn't feel as smooth as Windows.
      https://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonev...es-canyon-nuc/
      Really catch up on some more up to date numbers.

      The reality is current DXVK gets you most of the time inside 10% of the performance of windows. In fact close enough that if you have a bad anti-virus installed on windows result is DXVK+wine on Linux is faster and better quality. If the game is a Vulkan based title for windows most of the time under Wine you will be faster than windows. Of course opengl games for Windows also normally perform better under wine than on Windows. There are many games that run using DXVK that have no micro-stutter.

      So depending on your game collection and preferred windows anti-virus your best gaming choice could be Linux.

      Yes the windows version of a game under wine is better performance than a bad port to Linux.

      Yes I am looking forward to competition between wined3d and dxvk in the vulkan space.

      The reality like or not Windows is very close to losing the crown for the best choice for gaming to Linux. I wish I could see to alter this for productivity as well.

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      • #23
        What is different in windows that makes the micro stutter not happening there?

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        • #24
          Originally posted by bemerk View Post
          What is different in windows that makes the micro stutter not happening there?
          https://www.drivethelife.com/windows...indows-10.html

          That is what makes the problem even more tricky for wine to fix. Because micro stutter will happen under windows if you have setting configured particular ways or driver issues. So this is not a Linux only problem.

          So any game micro stuttering under wine also happen to micro stutter for someone out there running windows. Yes micro stutter can be at times made disappear on Linux using feral interactive gamemode. https://github.com/FeralInteractive/gamemode

          There are many different causes of micro stutter as well it is not a single source problem either.

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          • #25
            micheal wine-staging 4.6 has been tagged, no need waiting a few days before mentioning its release.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
              The reality is current DXVK gets you most of the time inside 10% of the performance of windows.
              Sorry, but I have to assume that you're completely blind to PC gaming. That you're using Forbes as a source further underlines this I'm afraid. Nobody cares when one or two titles manage to get within 10% of their Windows performance when run on a mini PC with ITX board and AMD graphics. But we're talking about thousands of games and current game development. Naturally will there always be a few titles in there that run faster on Linux, when truly they just run slowly on Windows. It's statistically inevitable, but to use this as an argument is blind and misleading.

              Before you buy a mini ITX PC with Linux for gaming would I recommend you buy an XBox or a PlayStation. That may also be what the Forbes article was trying to portrait - to draw a picture of how one could possibly create an alternative to game consoles by using a mini ITX PC with Linux. And why not?! For some titles will this be enough. But it ignores that both XBox and PlayStation are designed specifically as gaming platforms for mass consumers (and which also feature AMD hardware by the way) and that their APIs are tailored to that specific purpose, and so are many of the games that run on these consoles. It's not really a competition to gaming consoles. Then ask kids what they want. XBox, PS or a mini PC? ... You get the picture. Then there are high-end gaming PCs with Windows 10 and multiple GPUs and 4K displays that are just no match to any of this.

              Anyhow, it's cute but far from the reality.
              Last edited by sdack; 04-14-2019, 07:25 AM.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by torbido View Post
                DXVK is still in development, and if you have problem with it, it will be better to report it in DXVK's GitHub.
                Frankly, I've given up on DXVK. I do use it for one title on Linux, but when I want to play a game do I just boot into Windows 10 and get the best experience possible. DXVK isn't bad, it's neat, but no amount of tricks has gotten it anywhere close to the experience you get with Windows. Windows is all-round better when it comes to PC gaming and only when Microsoft is giving up the fight will this change. Until then can Linux only trail them, but for it to really catch up and outperform Windows as a gaming platform does it need more. It needs the cooperation of all the game developers for a start.

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by sdack View Post
                  Frankly, I've given up on DXVK. I do use it for one title on Linux, but when I want to play a game do I just boot into Windows 10 and get the best experience possible. DXVK isn't bad, it's neat, but no amount of tricks has gotten it anywhere close to the experience you get with Windows. Windows is all-round better when it comes to PC gaming and only when Microsoft is giving up the fight will this change. Until then can Linux only trail them, but for it to really catch up and outperform Windows as a gaming platform does it need more. It needs the cooperation of all the game developers for a start.
                  That is true, but if you really like Linux, play the game that runs well on Linux, on Linux, because the Linux market share will not increase itself by hoping Microsoft may suddenly allow competition or miraculously disappears!
                  Last edited by torbido; 04-14-2019, 07:46 PM.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by sdack View Post
                    Sorry, but I have to assume that you're completely blind to PC gaming. That you're using Forbes as a source further underlines this I'm afraid. Nobody cares when one or two titles manage to get within 10% of their Windows performance when run on a mini PC with ITX board and AMD graphics. But we're talking about thousands of games and current game development. Naturally will there always be a few titles in there that run faster on Linux, when truly they just run slowly on Windows. It's statistically inevitable, but to use this as an argument is blind and misleading.
                    Those Forbes numbers are not strange. Using Pop OS version of Linux included Feral Interactive gamemode out box.

                    Reality here sdack I could pull source after source from Valve own numbers to reviewers numbers there is a constant result if game works correctly under current dxvk the over head is 10% majority of the time. If game is vulkan under wine and it works the gain is 10 to 20 percent over windows. This is if you are using Feral Interactive gamemode.

                    Does not matter if it a ITX board or a full blown ATX the results are turning up the same.

                    Linux and Windows on Stuttering are basically the same if the OS is not currently configured for game/games expect you game to stutter.

                    Really Forbes had a good write up on 6 games tested. But many others have been testing games and finding exactly the same out come.

                    Of course sdack I would bet you did not have gamemode so the difference between Linux and windows would appear very bad against Linux as by default Linux is giving out fair processor time to back ground processors. This is like gaming on windows server without optimising. Yes it suxs gaming on Windows Server without changing settings as well. Server os vs desktop os at gaming without altering stuff the true desktop os wins every single time.

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
                      ... if game works correctly ...
                      And how many are those? Right, a tiny amount really. I have plenty of games, of which many don't run, some run unstable or require specialized versions of WINE-Staging, and then still don't get within 50% of their Windows performance. And even for the one game that I keep running under Linux, because it has a lot less hardware requirements and gets within 20%-30% of the Windows performance do I still find many players in the game's forum, who have a hard time just getting it to run. WINE's AppDB is full of negative reports even when some manage to rate it as platinum. So your claim is far from being the normality and this is what you are referring to when you're trying to talk about reality. Those are exceptions. And we haven't even been talking about things such as DSR, MSAA, TXAA, AO, and other driver features only available to Windows users.

                      If you want to pull numbers from Valve then just look at the Steam on Linux numbers. They've hardly moved up even with the release of Proton. Not to mention that not every good game is also available through Steam ...
                      Last edited by sdack; 04-14-2019, 11:31 AM.

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