What People Are Saying About GNOME [Part 3]

[kaczu]

1st. Apt-get doesn't exist in archlinux, but i do know how to use it just fine. Very familiar with both debian and Ubuntu. In fact, i am quite familiar with most package managers, including ports/portage/ABS, apt, yum, pacman/PKGBUILDS, etc, etc. Most i also am fully capable of packaging for as well. Again, im not using G2. I am using g3/compiz with my tablet - which is comparable to GS. do you have brain-damage or something?

Since I was responding to HIM and NOT YOU. Someone is on the pipe and surely isn't me.

The rest of what you said came down to.... It sucks... and in no way refutes the solutions of what I gave.

LOL. when did i make any complaint about not being able to disable suspend? I'm well-aware of this, dude. And i do have a laptop, this has never been a problem for me. This comment is totally pointless.

Oh wait a minute.... you think I was responding to YOU. LMAO LOL Holy crap..... you are bat-crap crazy (sorry for the insult but that post was just too funny)....LMAO. I had (past tense) at least some respect for your abilities, but not now..LMAO Holy crap...LMAO.. Whooo OMG. Like I said discussing anything with you would be pointless. Sorry ninez, but I think we're done here...LMAO. Happy Thanksgiving.

[alvadoraemon]

I did read your comments. Read the comment on the lack of dock and wondered to myself does this person not know how to use apt-get, much less there's extensions for the dock. Plus your comment about tablets was really good since G2 by itself isnt' too good for tablets without many of the customisations that any person with half a brain would implement. I didn't respond to u because just about all of it is easily overcome with rudimentary tools. Let's go through them..

1. Solution: Install a dock, or install flippery which puts back the global menu, puts a panel on the bottom, or install the dock extenstion....
(So i'm suppose to spend the effort responding to you when Google "gnome extensions" or apt-get install docky, awn... or whatever would easily solve this and is something that people even did with G2. )

2. Solution: I created a launcher EX: gnome-terminal --geometry=240x240 and pair that with the put window extension. Gnome terminals always open in workspace 2 and they are correctly sized for the workspace. How hard was that? Not at all.

3. Solution: The "suspend" only option in the User menu... Once again google is your friend. Extension for that and that's been around FOREVER. Almost a year at this point.

4. Don't have a laptop so I can't speak to this, but this is handled by acpid. You could script for this quite easily. There's code for it. Once again google...

5. Is a rehash of #3.

This lovely comment "Most of this "features" could be improved by using a persistent dock - with auto-hiding option -, a taskbar-window list-active windows only view - the lesser evil -, a workspace switcher icon in the Shell panel and integration of the lost "common sense". And there's extensions for all things you've listed here. Again, someone was supposed to take you seriously when your ability to use your web browser is your biggest handicap?? It would have been better for you if I didn't respond.

Kaczu, you're only acting as a fanboy... You don't have to tell me to search for solutions, because I'm enough old to search them, and I did ALL the thigs you said ;-). My opinion is based in facts, and your response doesn't give proper solutions to the big GS usability problems. Too childish.

Ah! I have managed ALL the MS OS Systems, Amigas, Ataris, Amstrad CPCs, Speccys, C64s,... and a plenty of Window managers and desktops, including Apple computers OS interfaces since the Mac Classic.

If you read carefully your own response, you tell me I have to SEARCH OUTSIDE the "standard" GS a set of features that imho MUST BE BY DEFAULT in the standard DESKTOP experience - tablets or netbooks are another beasts -... Search an extension, perform my own modifications in the Shell code, locate and modify specific, hidden and undocumented settings,... Do you really think that this is a proper response to BIG USABILITY PROBLEMS in many workflows? Are you serious? I worked everyday with many systems along MANY years, and I think that I can give a proper opinion about GS defects or any other Desktop out there.

Fanboyism again. Grow up and use all your brain to think - not only your fanboy zone -.

First: the dock extension is CRAP, because the "dock" can't hide, it's always on top - ruining the "clean desktop experience"- and it's most unconfigurable. It's a bad hack, period.

Second: the Suspend by default option could be named "gilipollez" in Spanish -my mother tongue, look at wordreference.com"... It's M-O-R-O-N-I-C because most people out there use Power Off and Hibernate out there. It's STUPID, and it's more stupid to force me to install an extension ONLY FOR ENABLING POWER OFF BY DEFAULT, instead the opposite - Suspend only MUST BE optional -. This decission is an EXTRAVAGANZA from any developer, and frustrates - and fucks - many people. Why is so difficult to make GNOME Shell devs to understand it?

Third: I gave real "solutions" that would be in the standard DESKTOP interface without too much effort from the devs, by dividing the OVERLOADED AND OVERCOMPLICATED Activities view in a set of better and more reasonable components; a "real" dock with autohiding, a window list outside the Activities view or at least a dedicated view to active programs, and a fast workspace selector that could be another dedicated view too... Today, GNOME devs are thinking only in more "pretty" apps, a "global" menu - Oh, Mac I love you too much!!! xDDD - and more "cosmetic" taks : https://live.gnome.org/ThreePointThree/Features

Of course, they like to broke extensions with each release, by an API change without clear warnings or advices to extensions developers; so making extensions isn't a good option to correct the behaviour of GS.

And now you will ask: why I don't "contribute" to implement my "solutions"? My reasons list:

- I don't know enough Javascript, because I don't program damn web pages to live.

- I don't have proper documentation of GNOME Shell Internals and processes, and I can't allow myself to loose too many time reading code.

- GNOME devs wouldn't allow me to broke their "dream", most of them are bad tempered interface nazis with an enormous NIH syndrome, and of course super fanboys of their work.

Kaczu, they had TWO YEARS to ask us - the poor users - what we should change of the Gnome Desktop, and the had almost all this year to correct the design failures of GS. They didn't want to hear us... Good for you if you like today's GS, but don't try to sell us a fridge in the North Pole because GS design mistakes are there.

[ninez]

Zero seconds? Any software you run takes more than zero seconds to execute. As I said, arguing with someone doesn't even understand that would be futile.

Oh sorry, almost zero seconds. I understand that just fine, thanks. Way to take things way to literally, and make another pathetic excuse.

Let me guess you'll respond to this with eight paragraphs of BS and wonder why I don't take you seriously. Every single excuse you listed doesn't address productivity, something being "blingy" doesn't have a damn thing to do with productivity. But you knew that. Maybe your Wobbly Windows got in the way, but regardless you wrote it anyway. Like I said, I knew the person I was dealing with a long time ago.

and yet, i've responded to all of yours, even though you've been just as insulting as you claim i have been, you're a complete troll and an asshole. Bling, animations and all that jazz, certainly can be applied to productivity. You claiming otherwise is stupid. add up a few seconds saved here and there, over 30 minutes, next add them up over over an hour, then the entire day, then week, then month and finally over the entire year. The amount of time saved will grow significantly. So there is a loss in productivity, as you have wasted a lot of time on bling.

if you can't make a good argument, than shut it. if you aren't willing to back up your claims, again, then shut it. dumbass.

Maybe you need a hug, a goldfish, or dog, to complain to. I don't know but I'm surely not paid to address your performance anxiety.

LOL. you're such an idiot. funny shit though.

[ninez]

Since I was responding to HIM and NOT YOU. Someone is on the pipe and surely isn't me.

my mistake. no problem. Early in the morning, haven't finished even a single cup of coffee

The rest of what you said came down. It sucks... and in no way refutes the solutions of what I gave.

No cigar. Flippery with it's static workspaces is not comparable to my 3x3 workspace, as one small example...and again Unix philosophy, one tool per job. and your solutions pretty muchsuck in comparison. They may provide a simplistic alternative, but don't allow nearly as much control (and AFAIK i've already tried them all).

Oh wait a minute.... you think I was responding to YOU. LMAO LOL Holy crap..... you are bat-crap crazy....LMAO. I had (past tense) at least some respect for your abilities, but not now..LMAO Holy crap...LMAO.. Whooo OMG. Like I said discussing anything with you would be pointless. Sorry ninez, but I think we're done here...LMAO. Happy Thanksgiving.

so, someone accidently, makes an honest mistake and that makes everything they have said /dev/null? who the fuck are you trying to kid? lol. That is an illogical fallacy.

keep talking, you just are embarrassing yourself, with your sheer stupidity.

[kaczu]

so, someone accidently, makes an honest mistake and that makes everything they have said /dev/null. who the fuck are you trying to kid.? That is an illogical fallacy.

Since you made it again in your response I don't believe you have the where with all to discuss very much with me. Sorry Ninez, but our discussion is and was totally pointless in a lot of respects. There's some points here and there, but it's completely muted with insane name calling, basically b@#&hing. Sorry but there's just no point. I'm happy you like what you like and all that jazz and I like what I like and that's about as far as we are going to get with this discussion.

Again, it's been nice, but there's just no need. Happy Holidays. See ya around sometime.

[ninez]

Since you made it again in your response I don't believe you have the where with all to discuss very much with me. Sorry Ninez, but our discussion is and was totally pointless in a lot of respects. There's some points here and there, but it's completely muted with insane name calling, basically b@#&hing. Sorry but there's just no point. I'm happy you like what you like and all that jazz and I like what I like and that's about as far as we are going to get with this discussion.

Again, it's been nice, but there's just no need. Happy Holidays. See ya around sometime.

excuses, excuses. And the insults have been a 2-way street.

you've still not made any real valid arguments, nor have you proven your claims. So, if you are done that is fine. But don't sit here and make excuse after excuse - and then do ridiculous things, like trying to create a fallacy, and use it as a cop-out. Which is what you continually have been doing, any chance you get.

you are a very dishonest little fucktard.

[alvadoraemon]

Errrr. No.

Why? I like Gnome Shell. Version 3.2 is awesome.

Gnome Shell 3.2 it's the version that should have been called GNOME Shell 3.0 :-D. The "Removable devices" icon in the notification bar and speed improvements were needed in the first version :-D

A nice improvement, but there is a long way ahead... If there is any soon.

The Glorious Flame War we have here is motivated by the Shell design shortcomings and failures in many workflows, from advanced "domestic" usage to "PRO" usage... I never told that Shell is awful; like ninez, I only said that GS has many questionable design decissions that don't improve usability and productivity unless you have a netbook, a tablet or you're a "3 app only" user... Precisely, the most important community that pushed Open Source and Linux adoption inside business and public administrations ;-).

Users like kaczu like today's GS because GS fill their needs, and they are reluctant to GS criticism because they like it too much... They like the "graphic candies", the - over- simplified "workflow" and the mobile environment philosophy, but maaaaaaany other users - like ninez and me - make true facts based criticism because we found some failures in "Desktop" usage. The response of GS devs and fanboys? Insults, questionable "solutions", "mi pennis is bigger than yours" attitude, ...

Kaczu replied us with the same hacks and "duct tape" solutions that Shell devs give, but their "solutions" are ugly hacks that only tech versed people like me would implement in half an hour or less; non average users go to other places - KDE, XFCE, LXDE, even Enlightenment -, or they come back to Windows or Apple - HORROR !!! :-( -.

The most important proof of Shell failures for a "classic desktop" usage is the Ubuntu Unity birth and the Linux Mint decission to develop GS special extensions, only to allow Mint desktop to be like the Mint GNOME 2 experience... When the two main "average joe" user distros left the GS "Faith" for another solutions, GNOME devs should ask themselves why... And KDE and MS folks are very happy now :-D.

Even Debian people, old time GNOMErs, rant about the new GS shortcomings: response to Andrew Cowie - http://jmtd.net/log/in_response/...

Like Jon Dowland said in his post, GS is opinionated sofware, and GS devs are against all movements to make the Shell more "desktop friendly"... Judge yourself :-).