Systemd Now Allows Custom BPF Programs To Be Loaded On Cgroups

[S.Pam]

Yes, the "trust" model is dated and inferior to the modern approach, but then again it was born long ago when security wasn't really a huge concern and the concept of "the user decides what software he can trust is all that is needed" was still believed by most.

In a way, that more innocent world view should be enough. But hey, these days when everyone is OK with their apps stealing all their data it seems obsolete.

[Danny3]

In a way, that more innocent world view should be enough. But hey, these days when everyone is OK with their apps stealing all their data it seems obsolete.

When it comes to security nothing is enough and not everyone is OK with tapps stealing their data.
On the phone you can solve most of the problems by replacing the recovery with a custom one and the stock Android ROM with a custom one like Lineage OS, Google Play store with F-droid store and put a firewall like AFWall+ where you can decide which apps are allowed and which not to use the internet or local network.
Hopefully Linux will get one day somewhat closer to Android high level of security, but people need to stop saying that Linux is more secure just because the whole burden of responsability is put on the user with those stupid nagging popups for password.

[jo-erlend]

This Trust(tm) model doesn't work when you get malware, viruses or bad add-ons, or what not. Besides, distros aren't infallible.

It's not infallible, but it is actually very efficient. Centralized distribution provides a sort group immunity. I'm not aware of any mainstream distro sending malware, viruses and bad add-ons to their users. Are you? Was it intentional or else, did they fix the problem when it was reported?

The main problem with centralized distribution, is that it requires a lot of dedication from each maintainer, meaning we're missing out on lots of resources, meaning trusted distributions must either be small, for-profit or progressing slowly. Users seem unwilling to accept any of those alternatives.

I'm not saying central distribution is bad, but only that we've outgrown it.

[skeevy420]

It's not infallible, but it is actually very efficient. Centralized distribution provides a sort group immunity. I'm not aware of any mainstream distro sending malware, viruses and bad add-ons to their users. Are you? Was it intentional or else, did they fix the problem when it was reported?

The main problem with centralized distribution, is that it requires a lot of dedication from each maintainer, meaning we're missing out on lots of resources, meaning trusted distributions must either be small, for-profit or progressing slowly. Users seem unwilling to accept any of those alternatives.

I'm not saying central distribution is bad, but only that we've outgrown it.

Arch and Manjaro beg to differ. Small, not-for-profit, fast progress.

Suse begs to differ. Both large, for profit, fast progress and large, for profit, slow progress releases. Leap & Tumbleweed.

iMHO, it's the release cycle model that needs to change. Both freeze and play catch up & freeze and play catch up for even longer (LTS) just sucks on a desktop where we damn-near require a decent amount of the system to be in a bleeding edge state just to account for Steam, AMDGPU, other misc. gaming reasons, media codecs, web security, security in general, and more.

It adds more burden on maintainers since they have to account for version 3 updating to version 5 from LTS to LTS and not getting some random file from program version 4 that program version 5 expects to be there but doesn't install and is planned to be fixed with program version 6 (which also now depends on application B version 2 but is froze at application B version 1 which means application B also needs backports to be compatible with program version 6). The maintainer gets stuck with buggy version 5 and has to backport fixes from new versions because the distribution freeze time didn't jive with the release cycle of that particular program and has to do the same thing for a dependency package. Multiply that scenario with an entire repository of software and then double it if the distribution is like Ubuntu with LTS and regular interval freezes and that's where all the increased burden comes from.

I'd be happy if LTS meant using an LTS kernel with the LTS Plasma desktop and other LTS versions of software that get both LTS and current/stable releases.

[starshipeleven]

Arch and Manjaro beg to differ. Small, not-for-profit, fast progress.

Suse begs to differ. Both large, for profit, fast progress and large, for profit, slow progress releases. Leap & Tumbleweed.

Also Fedora.

Still, the main issue of the distribution model is that you have a limited choice of applications, or versions of said applications, which is why most decent distros have "third party repositories" where third parties can upload or compile packages that aren't vetted by maintainers.

You know, AUR, OBS, PPAs and whatever Fedora/CentOS use.

For example, I needed a VPN client application that didn't suck for AirVPN, since their client on Linux works but does malfunction, and it's using its own OpenVPN and stuff from its folder which isn't exactly ideal.

I had to find a third party application for that, Qomui, which has a OBS, as no such application was available in Tumbleweed repositories.

[skeevy420]

I had to find a third party application for that, Qomui, which has a OBS, as no such application was available in Tumbleweed repositories.

Or why I'll pretty much stick with the Arch family or the Suse family. Tools like the AUR and OBS are essential. One might never need to use those, but if they do they're damn glad their distribution cares enough to provide the tools to make it that easy.

Since the trust model keeps cropping up, I trust what I build with community vetted sources over pre-compiled binaries that a PPA/etc provides me.

Oh, and also Microsoft. They follow the Suse method with Windows 10. Leap = LTSB/Enterprise and Tumbleweed = Pro/Home.

[jo-erlend]

Arch and Manjaro beg to differ. Small, not-for-profit, fast progress.

Suse begs to differ. Both large, for profit, fast progress and large, for profit, slow progress releases. Leap & Tumbleweed.

iMHO, it's the release cycle model that needs to change. Both freeze and play catch up & freeze and play catch up for even longer (LTS) just sucks on a desktop where we damn-near require a decent amount of the system to be in a bleeding edge state just to account for Steam, AMDGPU, other misc. gaming reasons, media codecs, web security, security in general, and more.

You didn't understand what I wrote. I didn't say small, for-profit or fast progress were mutually exclusive. Arch and Manjaro are small. SuSE is big and for-profit. My point was that it's very difficult to build a distribution that will be fast moving, free of charge and has packages for everything.

Your second point assumes that gaming and entertainment is the only valid use case for desktop computers, which is false.

[skeevy420]

You didn't understand what I wrote. I didn't say small, for-profit or fast progress were mutually exclusive. Arch and Manjaro are small. SuSE is big and for-profit. My point was that it's very difficult to build a distribution that will be fast moving, free of charge and has packages for everything.

Your second point assumes that gaming and entertainment is the only valid use case for desktop computers, which is false.

must either be small, for-profit or progressing slowly

Using the "either/or" way to split ideas makes it mean "pick one of the three choices" since the user could either do this, that, or the other which was followed by two examples where users could pick more than one of those choices in a distribution. I understood what you wrote just fine. You didn't write what you meant in a clear manner.

Web security and security in general aren't necessarily gaming or entertainment related yet both are things that should be as up-to-date as possible. AMDGPU isn't necessarily gaming related either. KDE and Gnome suck without a proper GPU driver. Putting AMDGPU between "Steam" and "other gaming reasons" doesn't make that very clear much like you going with "either/or" didn't help make your point very clear since "either/or" is speaking in absolutes.

Gaming and media/entertainment related tools are a big part of desktop computer usage and are some of the main reasons people run rolling release/bleeding edge desktops.

Your reading comprehension is worse than mine and you also need a primer course on comma usage that includes: Colons and Where to Use Them; Your Friend, The Semicolon; and my favorite chapter entitled "Place Me After "and" and "but" When Preceded By Two or More Complete Ideas; The Oxford Comma". The following graphic explains my favorite chapter:

[starshipeleven]

Or why I'll pretty much stick with the Arch family or the Suse family. Tools like the AUR and OBS are essential. One might never need to use those, but if they do they're damn glad their distribution cares enough to provide the tools to make it that easy.

Since the trust model keeps cropping up, I trust what I build with community vetted sources over pre-compiled binaries that a PPA/etc provides me.

You are making 0 sense. AUR and OBS are the same as PPAs and they are all "at your own risk" things.

Oh, and also Microsoft. They follow the Suse method with Windows 10. Leap = LTSB/Enterprise and Tumbleweed = Pro/Home.

Not really. Leap isn't the same kind of different from Tumbleweed as LTSB differs from Pro/home.

Normal Windows applications will work the same on either version because apart from a pile of modern bullshit none really cares about they are basically the same.

While it's not the first time that I get breakage on third party stuff made for Leap when I try to install it in Tumbleweed.

[skeevy420]

You are making 0 sense. AUR and OBS are the same as PPAs and they are all "at your own risk" things.

Compiled from known sources (AUR/OBS) and binaries compiled from a random party with sources you don't select (PPA) are not the same. All have the same "at your own risk" disclaimer, but that's about as similar as they are. The OBS still has that "binary from a random place" stigmata that PPAs have, but at least you know the packages used at build time and have control over the building process.

Not really. Leap isn't the same kind of different from Tumbleweed as LTSB differs from Pro/home.

Normal Windows applications will work the same on either version because apart from a pile of modern bullshit none really cares about they are basically the same.

Suse's release model is the closest Linux distribution analog to Windows since both are the only ones who really support both LTS and rolling release. There's Fedora/RHEL where one is free, one isn't, one is LTS, one isn't...only they're managed by different groups, unlike Suse or Windows, so they don't count.

Windows 10 LTSB doesn't always run what Windows 10 Pro/Home can run due to it lagging behind in regards to various features. They're currently in sync, but that hasn't always been the case -- don't ask me for specifics because it's just stuff I came across when I was reading up on LTSB before I installed it recently and I'm just pointing out that running the same software from one to the other doesn't always work just like with Leap and Tumbleweed. Google specifics if they really matter to you because it doesn't matter to me.

While it's not the first time that I get breakage on third party stuff made for Leap when I try to install it in Tumbleweed.

I see a bunch of words that only make up half a sentence.

Is that supposed to be "Tumbleweed, but then I compiled it myself and there were no breakages.", "Tumbleweed; Flatpak was a great alternative and ran the aforementioned stuff that broke just fine.", "Tumbleweed, but since AMDGPU-Pro needs older software and only supports Leap there really wasn't a whole lot I could do.", or "Tumbleweed, but after so many times of having stuff break I switched to Ubuntu."?