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NixOS Takes Action After 1.2GB/s ZFS Encryption Speed Drops To 200MB/s With Linux 5.0+

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  • ElectricPrism
    replied
    Honestly, I think Redhat's new Filesystems will probably kill ZFS. Redhat has a better reputation than Oracle and corporate users will not want to store important data on some makeshift Linux bridge.

    In the short term I'm sure Oracle will profit from support contracts as they have been, I don't think they will do the required work to keep the market cornered. There are lots of users that would still pick BTRFS over ZFS just because of in-tree support alone, and with Redhat's offerings coming to the table in the future I would not be betting money of ZFS being anything more than legacy.

    Leave a comment:


  • aht0
    replied
    Originally posted by ThoreauHD View Post
    There is a fundamental problem here. If the license is disallowing it from being maintained in the kernel, it's a novelty. It's nothing other than a hobby filesystem. And that's all it ever will be until Oracle's lawyers get off their ass. If they can buy multi-million dollar companies and rip them apart to their bare atoms, they can figure out licensing on one fking driver.

    No enterprise is going to put their faith in a dkms module for petabytes of data. They really need to sort this horse shit out before ZFS dies from apathy and neglect.
    Who do you think is backing much of it's development, despite it being out-of-tree? Enterprise.

    Be nice if further ZFS/ZoL/ZoF comparisons between Linux and FreeBSD included encryption speed testing.

    Leave a comment:


  • lumks
    replied
    Would all that afford go into a new in-tree zfs-like-FS + a tool to convert ZFS to that new filesystem. We would have it in 1-2 years from now on in a stable version. But since it's the linux community, let's cry and rant over licenses, try to workaround things and don't actually do something in the right direction.

    bravo.

    Leave a comment:


  • skeevy420
    replied
    Originally posted by ThoreauHD View Post
    There is a fundamental problem here. If the license is disallowing it from being maintained in the kernel, it's a novelty. It's nothing other than a hobby filesystem. And that's all it ever will be until Oracle's lawyers get off their ass. If they can buy multi-million dollar companies and rip them apart to their bare atoms, they can figure out licensing on one fking driver.

    No enterprise is going to put their faith in a dkms module for petabytes of data. They really need to sort this horse shit out before ZFS dies from apathy and neglect.
    It really isn't any different than Nvidia being an out of tree module due to the license keeping it out of the tree and it being closed source.

    Is the Nvidia driver a novelty? Nope.

    Is the Nvidia driver a hobby graphics driver? Not at all.

    Does that stop enterprises from using Nvidia? Hell fucking no.

    The only thing that needs to be sorted out are the personal feeling of the Linux kernel developers. Reading the mailing lists about this, they don't have any good reasons other than "we don't care about ZFS so we'll be assholes and intentionally cripple your FS even though y'all constantly try to work with us to try to come up with solutions that will make us, the Linux Kernel Devs, and the ZoL devs happy".

    Leave a comment:


  • numacross
    replied
    Originally posted by ThoreauHD View Post
    There is a fundamental problem here. If the license is disallowing it from being maintained in the kernel, it's a novelty. It's nothing other than a hobby filesystem. And that's all it ever will be until Oracle's lawyers get off their ass. If they can buy multi-million dollar companies and rip them apart to their bare atoms, they can figure out licensing on one fking driver.

    No enterprise is going to put their faith in a dkms module for petabytes of data. They really need to sort this horse shit out before ZFS dies from apathy and neglect.
    Oracle could open ZFS, but they won't since they are selling billions of dollars worth of solutions using it. Support contracts for those are very expensive as well.

    There are a lot of commercial products using OpenZFS so it's not going to die any time soon...

    Leave a comment:


  • ThoreauHD
    replied
    There is a fundamental problem here. If the license is disallowing it from being maintained in the kernel, it's a novelty. It's nothing other than a hobby filesystem. And that's all it ever will be until Oracle's lawyers get off their ass. If they can buy multi-million dollar companies and rip them apart to their bare atoms, they can figure out licensing on one fking driver.

    No enterprise is going to put their faith in a dkms module for petabytes of data. They really need to sort this horse shit out before ZFS dies from apathy and neglect.

    Leave a comment:


  • numacross
    replied
    Originally posted by Veerappan View Post
    Dear Oracle:

    Please relicense or dual license ZFS so we can be done with this once and for all.
    I'm not sure that this would help. OpenZFS diverged too much from the Oracle version, which is closed source now anyway. Their implementations are incompatible.

    Even if Oracle agreed, would re-licensing OpenZFS require all contributors to agree? Is that even practical?

    Originally posted by Veerappan View Post
    To be clear, I use ZFS on a BSD based NAS box and would like to use it on my other machines, but the license makes it too big a pain since every time I upgrade kernels, something breaks the dkms build.
    Can't you use a distribution that has support for ZFS like Ubuntu or Promox VE (there's probably more, but I haven't had the need to look for them)?

    Leave a comment:


  • skeevy420
    replied
    Originally posted by Veerappan View Post
    but the license makes it too big a pain since every time I upgrade kernels, something breaks the dkms build.
    That sometimes happens on kernel point releases. Not really a big deal since it's usually fixed within a week if you don't mind switching to a git master build until the next ZFS rc or point release. It's what I've been doing for around three years now.

    IMHO, it really isn't all that different than when the Nvidia kernel module breaks on point releases or when Catalyst used to do that AND require specific X.org versions. You run out-of-kernel stuff, you deal with out-of-kernel problems.

    Leave a comment:


  • skeevy420
    replied
    I just knew this would happen; that someone out there would just work around that commit. Time to apply this patch and recompile my kernel

    Thanks, NixOS & Mic92.

    Leave a comment:


  • Veerappan
    replied
    Dear Oracle:

    Please relicense or dual license ZFS so we can be done with this once and for all.

    Yours,
    A disgruntled developer who's forced to use your software at work


    To be clear, I use ZFS on a BSD based NAS box and would like to use it on my other machines, but the license makes it too big a pain since every time I upgrade kernels, something breaks the dkms build.
    Last edited by Veerappan; 05-11-2019, 12:16 PM.

    Leave a comment:

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