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Ubuntu 17.10: Continued Work On VA-API, Switching To GDM

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  • trek
    replied
    Originally posted by OneBitUser View Post
    Even the heaviest linux systems use much less than 1GB of RAM after boot and tick away on <10% CPU usage, which is already pretty low resource draw considering what you can do with such a system.

    The beauty of FOSS is that it offers light-weight and even modern (looking at you, LXQt) solutions as well besides the mainstream ones. But in a world where 4-8GB RAM is pretty standard on most computers you can't force those lightweight solutions down the throat of the masses just because they use 100-200MB less RAM. Frankly speaking, most people don't care that much about resource utilization, and the benefit of a light weight DE goes up in a puff of smoke once you open up a web browser or any other application using the internet (Spotify, Skype, etc.).
    most of people don't care about resource utilization, so they use micro$oft windows, with tons of memory resident programs

    but with Linux you cannot only revive old systems or extend the lifetime of your computer, but you can also work faster with a brand new PC

    if you let your system to spend 1GB of RAM and 10% of the CPU for an artistic display of your windows, why not to spend another 10% for the antivirus, 10% for the chat software, 10% for the compositor, etc... and you end up with an half-powered computer

    otherwise you can use 100% of CPU and RAM to effectively run the programs you need, with less stuttering, better startup times and less HDD utilization (as all your free RAM will be used as cache)


    Originally posted by OneBitUser View Post
    RAM is there to be used. If you need that 250MB chunk of RAM to make your system usable then it is underpowered.
    this is an old meme: 640K ought to be enough for anybody

    Leave a comment:


  • OneBitUser
    replied
    Originally posted by QuImUfu View Post
    I do use lightweight solutions even on my fast(er) Computer with 8gb ram because i do not want to waste ram other processes could use, really like a snappy system and value speed way more than looks. Web browsers do use lots of resources but 250MB less ram used (difference LXDE vs. KDE) can make it possible to run a browser or open one tab more.
    I understand that there is a niché for lightweight desktops, but on a normal system it's merely a matter of personal preferences, not a logical decision.
    RAM is there to be used. If you need that 250MB chunk of RAM to make your system usable then it is underpowered. If your system does not depend on that extra 250MB, then the choice to use a light DE is purely subjective. Which is perfectly fine on a personal level, but not really a valid design choice for a distro targeting large groups of users.
    I agree about Gnome wasting vs. KDE using more resources, I am a very happy KDE user myself. Fortunately I do not have to worry about memory usage with 32GBs of DDR4, but I would not consider running a lightweight desktop unless I only had 4 GB or less RAM at my disposal. Even then, I would first look for a lightweight browser before I gave up on a feature-rich DE like KDE or Cinnamon.
    Last edited by OneBitUser; 07-17-2017, 04:35 AM.

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  • Thaodan
    replied
    Looks like GNOME is the issue here not Ubuntu:
    “We’ve attempted to get the GNOME Shell lock screen running with LightDM and using GNOME Shell as a LightDM Greeter. Which this still seems possible, it’s not easy to patch GNOME Shell as the GDM code is hard to decouple".

    https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ub...ne/004969.html

    So they need to support another DM, as GDM is DE dependent.

    Leave a comment:


  • QuImUfu
    replied
    Originally posted by OneBitUser View Post
    They use it because no-one wants to run this on Pi... if you do want to, then I think that's the perfect example of a user error: the Pi was not intended to run a "modern" desktop environment and "modern" desktop environments were not meant to be run on the Pi. You have other options, end of story.
    That would be true if, and only if GDM would offer anything LightDM doesn't offer. As this is (i think) not the case, the resources are wasted.
    KDE is using much more Resources than LXDE but it does offer special effects, a nice looking menu etc. In this case the resources are not wasted but used (for something i do not deem important, but nevertheless used).
    I do use lightweight solutions even on my fast(er) Computer with 8gb ram because i do not want to waste ram other processes could use, really like a snappy system and value speed way more than looks. Web browsers do use lots of resources but 250MB less ram used (difference LXDE vs. KDE) can make it possible to run a browser or open one tab more.

    Leave a comment:


  • sheepdestroyer
    replied
    Here's hoping that Ubuntu takes the opportunity to commit patches upstream unlike their former selves. That's great that they finally settled on a common core of technologies with everyone else instead of reinventing each wheel, but that would be even better if they participated this time.

    Leave a comment:


  • OneBitUser
    replied
    Originally posted by QuImUfu View Post
    Some gnome applications are working and very much usable, but gdm is not at all.
    Just install it eg. on a pi and you'll see it takes longer to start than lxde. And much longer than LightDM. Why would someone decide to use this software?
    They use it because no-one wants to run this on Pi... if you do want to, then I think that's the perfect example of a user error: the Pi was not intended to run a "modern" desktop environment and "modern" desktop environments were not meant to be run on the Pi. You have other options, end of story.

    Besides... people keep throwing about adjectives like "resource-hog" and "power hungry" when it comes to most newer desktop environments, but the fact is that this "resource hogging" hardly matters on any hardware that was released in the past five years. Some older or extremely low powered hardware might struggle with Plasma 5, Unity or Gnome 3, but you can't (and shouldn't) rein in the mainstream desktop development for the sake of backwards compatibility with hardware that is hardly in use anymore. Even the heaviest linux systems use much less than 1GB of RAM after boot and tick away on <10% CPU usage, which is already pretty low resource draw considering what you can do with such a system.

    The beauty of FOSS is that it offers light-weight and even modern (looking at you, LXQt) solutions as well besides the mainstream ones. But in a world where 4-8GB RAM is pretty standard on most computers you can't force those lightweight solutions down the throat of the masses just because they use 100-200MB less RAM. Frankly speaking, most people don't care that much about resource utilization, and the benefit of a light weight DE goes up in a puff of smoke once you open up a web browser or any other application using the internet (Spotify, Skype, etc.).

    Originally posted by QuImUfu View Post
    (on the other hand Ldebian is hard to say )
    LDebian is hard to pronounce, but LX-DEbian seems like a half decent name for a distro.
    Or you could get a French project lead and call it L'Debianne. Fancy.

    Leave a comment:


  • caligula
    replied
    Originally posted by QuImUfu View Post
    Some gnome applications are working and very much usable, but gdm is not at all.
    Just install it eg. on a pi and you'll see it takes longer to start than lxde. And much longer than LightDM. Why would someone decide to use this software?
    Developers don't care. Your new machine will have 8 to 16 cores, 64 gigs of RAM, and 12 TB hard drives. There's plenty of headroom for GDM to grow. If it slows down, buy a faster NVMe SSD. Maybe new NVMe version will support 10+ GB/s SSD drives.

    Leave a comment:


  • haagch
    replied
    Originally posted by AsuMagic View Post
    (NB: KWin is superior)
    Then why does its rendering stutter when compositing OpenGL applications? https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=381444
    I have to use kwin with compton because of that...

    Leave a comment:


  • M@GOid
    replied
    Originally posted by InsideJob View Post
    I know it's kind of silly, but I've been using the same DVD-RW mini-DVDs for my Linux distros for the last 10 years. Now I have to use big honkin' DVDs because all the Ubuntu flavors are over 1.4GB Keeping my fingers crossed they "demoted" enough packages from the install media to get the size back down.

    Many laptops don't even come with DVD drives these days so I guess most people are installing from flash drives.
    You bet people are using pendrives/flashdrives/whatever. Is a lot faster to write and is much better once it is running. I recently bought a nice Lexar P20, very fast, to install all the distros I need in one flashdrive, using YUMI. Heck, even all the Windows ISOs and whatever bootable tool I need, can be shoved in those 32GB.

    Unless you really need it man, send those DVD's away and use a flashdrive. You will not look back.

    Leave a comment:


  • dungeon
    replied
    Well, since they plan to use GNOME and GDM is short of GNOME Display Manager and only that work properly with systemd/logind/xrootless/etc... it make sense all these shits scenario to came together

    Leave a comment:

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