Fedora 22 Will Likely Make Apps In The Software Center Have AppData

[gens]

Opinions are worth something if you back it up with data and do it in a convincing and constructive way. Drive by one liners that don't talk about anything else but a file format have a net negative value.

Linus gets paid by a industry consortium 501c(6). Not a regular non-profit foundation. 501c(3). Therefore all the funding comes from commercial companies. He is NOT a volunteer.

Ps: Fix your formatting. Its awfully unreadable.

have you ever heard of "critical thinking" ?
from what i read on phoronix from you, you don't seem to employ it
at all

following the very first link i put concerning XML you can get to multiple clear detailed explanations as to why XML sucks

yes opinions
but don't try to make it a "human", "subjective" and "biased" thing, as it is not
take five minutes and think what it is that you are promoting and if it is good for the whole of linux

fuck politics
fuck every god damned idiot talking about "your subjective opinion" but not knowing how a computer works
read a fucking book once in a while
also fuck politics

and don't complain about my formatting or il get all James Joyce on your ass

[RahulSundaram]

yes opinions
but don't try to make it a "human", "subjective" and "biased" thing, as it is not

But it is. You can throw a bunch of links and random insults but at the end of the day, that is all you have. An opinion. Nothing more. Critical thinking would involve doing your own thinking and actually making a convincing argument.

[VinzC]

But it is. You can throw a bunch of links and random insults but at the end of the day, that is all you have. An opinion. Nothing more. Critical thinking would involve doing your own thinking and actually making a convincing argument.

I've read through your flame war and I can summarize it that way: you've pissed off gens.

Let me tell you one thing: XML is a formatting language for compound document and trying to use that to store configuration data is wrong. If you need an analogy, it's the same as using ODF, OOXML, Latex for the same task: it's the wrong tool for the wrong job.

There are so many reasons to pickup the wrong tool for the wrong job yet it doesn't make it right, even if organizations like RedHat are pushing it hard. And using XML for anything else than rich, compound documents or transient data exchange is just wrong. It's as wrong as wanting to take notes on the fly with a painting canvas, a set of brushes and acrylic paints, a set of framing toolkits, thinners and accessories while a single, blank sheet of paper and a pencil are enough.

Configuration files are no rich, compound documents. Nor are they transient data. Hence XML is inappropriate.

Now my personal opinion: I've seen tons of XML in many situations and all I can say is that the ones who used XML for that most probably had not understood one thing about what XML is or is for. The result was indigest at best, a crapload of sick ideas at worst. I almost feel the urge to vomit anytime I find myself required to fiddle with the XML some tortured soul had written. Examples? Polkit, Gnome, xfont config... That makes a strong argument to refrain from using XML at all... unless you have a Freaking Hell of a God damn'it really, valid reason for not trying anything else.

It's not that you'll fail. It's just that you're giving yourself too much a hassle in the first place and imposing the same hassle to other people who haven't necessarily agreed. So when someone tells you it's not a good idea to promote XML to people, it's common sense, like it or not.

[anda_skoa]

Let me tell you one thing: XML is a formatting language for compound document and trying to use that to store configuration data is wrong.

I agree, but AppStream data is not configuration data. These are data records, data base entries formatted for transfer.

XML, or rather the tooling available for it, allows for a wide range of automated processing.
For example XSLT can be used to reformat the data for display in HTML, convert into SQL insertion queries, etc.
XQuery can be used to retrieve data, e.g. for statistical analysis, without necessarily having to write code.
It can formally be validated and easily composed into sets or records (e.g. just insert as-is into a larger document structure).

As written earlier today's format of preference would probably be JSON, but at the time when AppStream adoption of XML related technologies and tooling was much higher.

Cheers,
_

[gens]

thx VinzC for the nice wording

@ anda_skoa
they are data records but the only data type used is UTF8 text, so a plain "config" stile format is good enough (only need in that case is to escape quotation marks within quoted strings)
no need to specify encoding as there is only one
no need to specify data type as there is only one
and so on

[anda_skoa]

they are data records but the only data type used is UTF8 text, so a plain "config" stile format is good enough (only need in that case is to escape quotation marks within quoted strings)
no need to specify encoding as there is only one
no need to specify data type as there is only one
and so on

Sure, I am not saying that a handcrafted format would not also be possible.

A config style format can mimick structure by using path-like keys, using some form of key suffix for keys that can appear in initernationalized form.

One could write a specification for that, one could write some form low-level parser library, one could write the processing tools.

Those who deal with this data apparently preferred to use something where these existed.
A choice made by those most affected by the choice. Not likely to have been picked at random.

Cheers,
_

[gens]

no need to complicate things

one_word_variable: value

full_string_variable: "some string, even with \"quotes\"
and multiple lines in it"

can_also_be_like: "

this is a multiline string,
with following and trailing newlines ignored in the parser for readability

"

even .desktop files are more or less like that (well, more or less like INI files)

http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/apa.html

[anda_skoa]

Not sure what you mean with complicating things, this is what I wrote, no?

Cheers,
_

[gens]

then i misunderstood one detail
my bad