Debian Is Back To Discussing Init Systems, Freedom of Choice

[MoonMoon]

and then transitioning to systemd in STABLE?

No, they did not transition to systemd in Stable. You don't even get bugfixes in Stable. So if you, your father or colleagues at work have problems with the transition to systemd then you are either running Testing or Unstable, development versions not meant to be run on production systems and expected to have bugs. If you can't handle that then don't run a development version, simple as that.

[brosis]

This is why I migrate from Debian. Instead of doing a right thing, they are broken and unfinished everywhere - the desktop OS is so unpolished and is so text-based-80ties, requiring a lot of tuning after install, and instead of doing even system init right, they gather to discuss ways to invent more ways, just because they think its a correct way. Philosophy in a bath tube on mail lists instead of practical application. Even with amount of crap Ubuntu has done over years, they still managed to be ahead of Debian.....
Archlinux, Calculate or Manjaro are currenly best depending on task.

[brosis]

Really starting to think that Jackson had some kind of mental break and is no longer in touch with reality. Does he think that Gnome will be patched to not need logind? Or maybe he wants it removed all together, even after it just resumed it's position as default?

Like bacteria naturally evolving towards oxygen breathing, they now discuss how not to depend on oxygen (back to stone age) or how do patch into hybrid frankenstein.
Why not fix an issue when and only if issue actually rises, instead of sitting on road discussing possible dangers instead of learning by going? The only thing they benefit is time and speed waste.

[Guest]

Debianees like to keep their backup for case that systemd devs really go crazy and implement skynet :-]

[Ouroboros]

I thought this was discussed thoroughly during the Upstart vs. systemd debate? They would basically need to fork and maintain their own GNOME3, updating to future GNOME3 releases will be a PITA and it's likely that they would fall severely behind upstream. That's just for GNOME3.

I also remember there being a lack of manpower/maintainers/volunteers, too.

Debian has slowly become fragmented and dated. I stopped using Debian(Sid)/Ubuntu because a lot of their major libraries and applications were a few years behind upstream releases for various reasons and I found that unacceptable.
FWIW, this year they've updated a lot, but I doubt nearly all, of the outdated packages I originally stopped using Debian over(I can't even remember most of them anymore). I think most packages are only ~1 year behind at most now.

EDIT: Simple example of an outdated major application: Debian is still on Eclipse 3.8.1, released September 15, 2012.

Now, if Debian were to try and maintain compatibility with other init systems, I have a feeling we can expect to go back to updates being held and having to use ancient versions of software and libraries.

[pouar]

EDIT: Simple example of an outdated major application: Debian is still on Eclipse 3.8.1, released September 15, 2012.

That's nothing, OpenBSD uses GCC 4.2.1, released July 18, 2007
And GCC 3.3.6, released May 3, 2005

Although you can install newer ones from ports

[pouar]

That's nothing, OpenBSD uses GCC 4.2.1, released July 18, 2007
And GCC 3.3.6, released May 3, 2005

Although you can install newer ones from ports

OpenBSD is still a great OS BTW

[Ouroboros]

That's nothing, OpenBSD uses GCC 4.2.1, released July 18, 2007
And GCC 3.3.6, released May 3, 2005

Although you can install newer ones from ports

Debian Sid and OpenBSD are completely different and, although I haven't looked into it, I'm sure most updates are withheld for completely different reasons.

[pouar]

Debian Sid and OpenBSD are completely different and, although I haven't looked into it, I'm sure most updates are withheld for completely different reasons.

I have, and yes there different reasons, in fact OpenBSD has a much better reason that I actually agree with, their compilers are actually heavily patched versions because the newer ones produce broken code when they try to add more features and optimizations, especially on less popular platforms. At least according to this http://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=137530560232232&w=2. I have experienced a few stupid bugs on my own when using GCC. I still like it though (and Clang too).

[GreatEmerald]

My reaction:



I really need to return to my PW/AA Debian cases now. In fact, I'm about done with one project, so it's a good time to do so!