Originally posted by vadix
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Is Antergos Arch Linux Really Faster Than Ubuntu, Fedora?
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Originally posted by stiiixy View PostYes, but can the tweaks to Arch be applied to any other distro's, and will they perform similarly. Truly reproducible, or is Arch doing some 'magic faerie dust' things to their binaries before comilation that is opening up feature's for more tweaking?
excep a few things: there are some tweaks that are not really explained what they do but are EXTREMLY dangerous. in my opinion this is absolutely stupid to provide such tips without warnings and even any reference for more informations.
i got shocked when i saw they tell you to try different values for kernel.io_delay_type and nothing more. and there were other examples, not as bad as this one but overall their tuning wiki pages seemed more or less worthless to me.
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I've been using Arch for the past 8 years. The same installation for the past 5 (with changes to systemd, /lib and so on) and it's as good as it was at the beginning.
As many said, this is yet another useless test. The beauty of Arch lies in the liberty it provides when it comes to setting up and configuring your systems. It was like that with init and it still is with systemd. You install what you want, you selects the services you want, you tweak the system the way you want it to be. The smoothness you get after that won't show up on a test like this. This has to do more with the package that is being used (cfq in case of the IO scheduler).
Can you do this in other distros? Sure. Though it's much more difficult when the whole package is given to you and you have to dig up into the core, and most of the time either you won't have the same results, or you'll break something.
ABS is another piece of gold. When I have to touch a Ubuntu distro now, and I have to look up for a software that's not in the official repositories, add it, the sign it, and you end up with 20 different repositories...that's a mess. You look up for the package in AUR and install it with yaourt. Done.
Pacman is another beast. apt-get is just a toy compared.
Is Arch for everyone? Maybe not and I don't recommend it to everybody, but reducing the comparison of the distros to this test...you can't expect much more from Phoronix.
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Originally posted by a user View Posti just went through the archwiki page for tuning and i didn't find anything worthnoting, especially nothing that you didn't find on ANY OTHER common distro's info pages, even ubuntu.
Originally posted by a user View Postexcep a few things: there are some tweaks that are not really explained what they do but are EXTREMLY dangerous. in my opinion this is absolutely stupid to provide such tips without warnings and even any reference for more informations.
i got shocked when i saw they tell you to try different values for kernel.io_delay_type and nothing more. and there were other examples, not as bad as this one but overall their tuning wiki pages seemed more or less worthless to me.
Originally posted by Archwiki sysctlNote: If you have the kernel documentation installed (linux-docs), you can find detailed information about sysctl settings in /usr/lib/modules/$(uname -r)/build/Documentation/sysctl/. It is highly recommended reading these before changing sysctl settings.
Originally posted by sysctl documentationThe files in this directory can be used to tune and monitor
miscellaneous and general things in the operation of the Linux
kernel. Since some of the files _can_ be used to screw up your
system, it is advisable to read both documentation and source
before actually making adjustments.Last edited by ninez; 28 June 2014, 12:28 PM.
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Yeah, author got in the trap. Arch is faster because it is simple and easy, it lets solve your problems faster, and contains tons of working stuff in aur. Distros like Fedora and Ubuntu are too complicated and self-devoted: first they try to solve a problem by increasing utility complexity, then they add an utility to control utility, more and more. That 's a bullshit. Awesome is awesome because it lets you run programs, work with windows-and nothing else.
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Originally posted by wstorm View PostYeah, author got in the trap. Arch is faster because it is simple and easy, it lets solve your problems faster, and contains tons of working stuff in aur. Distros like Fedora and Ubuntu are too complicated and self-devoted: first they try to solve a problem by increasing utility complexity, then they add an utility to control utility, more and more. That 's a bullshit. Awesome is awesome because it lets you run programs, work with windows-and nothing else.
And compare:
apt-get install
vs
pacman -S
it is just faster out of the box by 4 letters - about 1 sec of speed gain, at least for me. =)
Pacman always works right, apt-get may turn your system into a mess.
No graphical installation is nice bydef - no overhead, just couple of setup cmds, and when something go wrong, you can fix it. I don't only like everything about ****ing systemd, but that was necessary adoption.
In general, arch leave you control over system, while ubuntu can't offer that. It is proprietary after all.
I used Gentoo before, but it is not optimal because in Gentoo you need to compile every package, as i know.
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Originally posted by ninez View PostUbuntu/debian's pages, AFAICT aren't consolidated at all. In most cases, it would be quicker to google and hit XYZ random blog, rather than using their distro resources. [and often when you google that kind of thing - Archwiki appears before XYZ distro's docs do].
"not as bad as this one" pretty much says it all. sysctl isn't persistent across boots unless you specify that [in one of the links/man pages]. io_delay_type, depending on value, may be unstable on some systems, h/w [I've never experienced a problem.
the problem is that it defines the io method/port for transfaring io data to subdevices, e.g. when flashing/updating firmwares.
changing this can corrupt any firmware transfer.
this setting is nothing that should ever be mentioned in a tweaking guide.
but i havent' touched that since fedora dayz/long time ago] - but again, NOT persistent settings.
There is also a certain expectation within the Arch community; that users are competent and somewhat proactive [meaning
but anyway, the claim of good arch linux tweak guides on their wiki is simply bullshit. it is the worst of its kind i ever saw on the internet.
even ubuntu has some better site regarding this matter as they at least do post useless stuff that is even dangerous. many people not so competent may switch to arch linux, stumble on this wiki and do bad things.
your not afraid to look up/investigate something further, if needs be. ie: not a lot of hand-holding in Arch]. Regardless, you are 100% wrong, when you claim there are no warnings about this stuff;
i only said regarding some things there no warnings and i gave the special bad example of io_delay_type. for this setting, the by far most dangerous one on their site (as far as i saw) there is NO WARNING!
or did you just skip over that part...and what does every doc/txt/ file for sysctl say?
hmmm.... So because you ignored what the wiki actually suggests and have never looked at the sysctl docs - it's now ArchWiki's fault? funny stuff.
a lot of the sysctl settings found in the arch wiki are found all over the place with better explenations and hints, even on ubuntu sites (which either dislike though). i am not saying that ubuntu has good docs or tips and tricks pages.
i'm just saying that archwiki isn't really better at all, especial by far not like some people here claim. in fact most of their wanna be tricks are worthless. it's the same pseudomagic tweaks guides i see over and over from wannabe competent linux users.
seems to be the current fashion, jumping to arch linux, feeling like a linux-pro and telling others magically tweak their system.
i'm quite sick of this.Last edited by a user; 29 June 2014, 05:52 AM.
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Originally posted by a user View Posti just went through the archwiki page for tuning and i didn't find anything worthnoting, especially nothing that you didn't find on ANY OTHER common distro's info pages, even ubuntu.
Originally posted by a user View Postthere are some tweaks that are not really explained what they do but are EXTREMLY dangerous. in my opinion this is absolutely stupid to provide such tips without warnings and even any reference for more informations.
Originally posted by a user View Posti got shocked when i saw they tell you to try different values for kernel.io_delay_type and nothing more. and there were other examples, not as bad as this one but overall their tuning wiki pages seemed more or less worthless to me.
Note: If you have the kernel documentation installed (linux-docs), you can find detailed information about sysctl settings in /usr/lib/modules/$(uname -r)/build/Documentation/sysctl/. It is highly recommended reading these before changing sysctl settings.
Of course you can find all of this by googling and go to some random sites but the community have gathered tweaks from those sites and put them all in the wiki so you will have an organized page with all the info you need. If you don't like something or wanted to add something, just create an account and change what you thought is not good. This will help not only Arch users but other linux users as well.
p/s: Sorry for bad english
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