Originally posted by strcat
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GNOME 3.12 Might Come To Fedora 20, Packages Available
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Originally posted by finalzone View PostUseless for you, you mean, because of your dislike of Gnome Shell past 3.6.
Originally posted by finalzone View PostHave you tried them before jumping to the conclusion?
Originally posted by finalzone View PostThanks a lot for insulting some professional users running on that DE showing down. Now, have you paid these desktop environments developers to do these tasks? No?
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Originally posted by AdamW View Posttoo troll; didn't read
FYI, me and most friends were running fedora from start. more or less we all moved to korora. but, based on how F.N. is moving that will probably change too since for ?community? project you're damn picky on what community is
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Fedora is too cliquish, and doesn't really want outsiders views.
I was at flock where a lot of f.N was hammered out, and I like the idea, but I really don't like how they seem to ignore other voices. Unless you are a well known contributor, or a bombastic troll you simply get ignored even if no one is addressing your concerns. That has me worried. ...and they wonder how to increase the signal to noise ratio amongst the community... In short, if you want them to address your point, you apparently need to be an unsocial ass. Simply commenting in thread after thread does nothing.
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Originally posted by liam View PostI was at flock where a lot of f.N was hammered out, and I like the idea, but I really don't like how they seem to ignore other voices. Unless you are a well known contributor, or a bombastic troll you simply get ignored even if no one is addressing your concerns. That has me worried. ...and they wonder how to increase the signal to noise ratio amongst the community... In short, if you want them to address your point, you apparently need to be an unsocial ass. Simply commenting in thread after thread does nothing.
You didn't make any concrete suggestions that I can see - the closest I can see is "What I would like to see is Fedora's designers look at any perceived problems in G3's DESIGN and propose some solutions." and "I see no reason why Fedora can't address some of the design short comings of Gnome that Gnome developers won't really touch.", but that's still pretty vague. It's also kind of a dead letter, because AFAIK, all the most active Fedora design team members are actually active in GNOME design as well.
So, it's not particularly surprising that your emails got a muted response. I don't like the word 'meritocracy' (because F/OSS projects rarely really are pure meritocracies, if they're being honest with themselves, and even when they are they have biased entry criteria which is a huge problem in itself, but let's not get into that), but you shouldn't expect your views to be acted upon or even responded to *just because you post them*, in the context of a major project like Fedora.next: people have to find them interesting / useful / compelling. I know this sounds harsh, but...it's kind of the truth. (note: I'm not on the desktop WG, this is not An Official Voice talking to you. Just my interpretation.)
also, on a purely practical level, your quoting style makes it very difficult to figure out which bits of your post are yours, and which bits are quotes. This may be a bug in your client (phone?) - it looks like maybe it can't quote flowed paragraphs correctly.
What kind of a response to your emails were you expecting, in an ideal case?
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Death of Fedora, Long Live Fedora!
Originally posted by justmy2cents;399758as much as i was enthusiastic about Fedora.Next on first information, initial hype in me started dying when i dug more into it. even just watching [urlhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOFud4cgtV0[/url]
It has always appeared to me that since Fedora typically directs bug reports upstream, you'd be better to contribute directly to the main project instead of Fedora. In this regard, no change is going to promote more Fedora developers because they're heading upstream. It may however encourage more developers to use Fedora.
Lastly, I don't understand having issues with Gnome 3. It's significantly faster (Super,g,e,Enter = gedit; Super,t,e,Enter=terminal) than anything else I've used and the extensions are a lot better than the Gnome 2 way of running a bunch of small applications with windows consuming space on the screen and taskbar.
At the 43:00 mark, I was surprised that the KDE user didn't recognize that a KDE-only integration isn't nearly as complete as the Gnome-only integration and configuration utilities like policycoreutils-gui don't have a KDE counterpart. A Fedora.next Workstation that primarily uses KDE is going to have to have the gnome libraries installed to do basic configuration anyway.
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Originally posted by AdamW View PostI read all your posts to desktop@ (I'm assuming you're Liam Bulkley, here). You seemed to be working from a basis that GNOME is "touch inspired and consumption-focused", which it really isn't, which makes it hard to put a lot of stock in the conclusions you drew from there. (I'm one of about three people actually using GNOME on a touch device at present, and if you do that, it's painfully obvious it's not based around touch *at all*). It's designed to be *distraction free*, which is as important to engineers as anyone. I work on Fedora all day long, and I find GNOME 3 the best environment in which to do it. I don't need a *complex* desktop environment to do productive engineering work, because the desktop itself is not what you use to do productive work. It's a framework that, for me at least, works best when it's as unobtrusive as possible. You didn't make any concrete suggestions that I can see - the closest I can see is "What I would like to see is Fedora's designers look at any perceived problems in G3's DESIGN and propose some solutions." and "I see no reason why Fedora can't address some of the design short comings of Gnome that Gnome developers won't really touch.", but that's still pretty vague. It's also kind of a dead letter, because AFAIK, all the most active Fedora design team members are actually active in GNOME design as well. So, it's not particularly surprising that your emails got a muted response. I don't like the word 'meritocracy' (because F/OSS projects rarely really are pure meritocracies, if they're being honest with themselves, and even when they are they have biased entry criteria which is a huge problem in itself, but let's not get into that), but you shouldn't expect your views to be acted upon or even responded to *just because you post them*, in the context of a major project like Fedora.next: people have to find them interesting / useful / compelling. I know this sounds harsh, but...it's kind of the truth. (note: I'm not on the desktop WG, this is not An Official Voice talking to you. Just my interpretation.) also, on a purely practical level, your quoting style makes it very difficult to figure out which bits of your post are yours, and which bits are quotes. This may be a bug in your client (phone?) - it looks like maybe it can't quote flowed paragraphs correctly. What kind of a response to your emails were you expecting, in an ideal case?
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Originally posted by liam View PostNow, none of the preceding would matter if fedora didn't specifically create a prd for the ws that called out "developers" (my term for sysadmins, software engineers, and cs students) as the target. To that end, I know that gnome has some fundamental design issues that upstream simply won't touch (as they say, if it's a problem of design, it's not a problem) so fedora is in a position where it will need to make some decisions.
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Originally posted by kigurai View PostAs someone who regularly fills pretty much all of the above mentioned roles, I would just like to ask everyone to stop with the "Gnome Shell is not suitable for developers"-meme as it is becoming quite tiresome.
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Originally posted by kigurai View PostAs someone who regularly fills pretty much all of the above mentioned roles, I would just like to ask everyone to stop with the "Gnome Shell is not suitable for developers"-meme as it is becoming quite tiresome.
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